New car time

[Al Czervik]

Time to replace the '99 C-Class Merc.

Bimmer 5 series or another Merc?

Suggestions?

[Ankf00]

5 series body? http://www2.hornfans.com/wwwthreads/images/icons/pukey.gif

slushbox? http://www2.hornfans.com/wwwthreads/images/icons/pukey.gif

I prefer the merc style though, I say go for that if you don't want an Audi

[Al Czervik]

5 series body? http://www2.hornfans.com/wwwthreads/images/icons/pukey.gif

slushbox? http://www2.hornfans.com/wwwthreads/images/icons/pukey.gif

I prefer the merc style though, I say go for that if you don't want an Audi

Bad experience w/ VW/Audi products in the past. It'll be a long time before I buy another.

[dando]

As much as I'd like to, I just can't vote for the new Bimmer. The styling is cr@p, and based on the reviews I've read, the iDrive is a POS. When I replace my E36, I'll be looking @ the A6, or perhaps a used 530/540/M5. I love Merc styling from the outside, but the interiors have always left me wanting.

-Kevin

[Ankf00]

Aston


Martin



get the extended warranty :D

[cart7]

Keep the Merc and have some fun without spending all that cash.
http://www.fast-autos.net/ford/05mustang5.jpg

Yuummmm... baby. You can't beat it for 28 G's.

[Dirty Sanchez]

Never Follow.

[TrueBrit]

Friends don't let friends drive Fords.....

[racer2c]

If you're into trendy vehicles, I saw this list of the top 'buzzworthy' cars on the news this morning.

1.2005 Chrysler 300C HEMI
2.2004 Dodge Magnum HEMI
3.2004 Nissan Titan
4.2005 Pontiac GTO
5.2004 Chevrolet Colorado

[Tifosi24]

I don't know how the Magnum can make that list, it is a car without soul. My dad and I took a test drive and I felt like I was just in a cold piece of steel and nothing else.

[Audi_A4]

I am not a c class fan, over priced for a n OK car.... The new E class benz is a really nice ride.

I had a 2000 A4, it was great, just sold it 2 months ago. (Resale is awful) ... bought a 2005 Maxima which I do not like, its a land yacht but does have a heated steering wheel :gomer: I still love the 2005 A4 but the depreciation kept me away.

If you like SUV's check ouot the lexus RX 330, it handles great, is fast and nimble.

[Al Czervik]

Never Follow.

See #3 above. Very nice cars. Very bad reliability issues with the brand in the past.

[manic mechanic]

Wait 6 months and take a serious look at the new Infiniti M45 when it arrives, then save a load of $$$ over der deutscher kars by getting one!

I like everything but the switchgear in the Infinitis. Best value out there IMHO. :thumbup:



manic

[Gnam]

Wait 6 months and take a serious look at the new Infiniti M45 when it arrives, then save a load of $$$ over der deutscher kars by getting one!

I like everything but the switchgear in the Infinitis. Best value out there IMHO. :thumbup:
manic

M45
http://www.pdxguide.com/cars/2004/infiniti/M45.jpg
http://press.nissan-global.com/COMMON/IMAGES/CURRENT_US/INFINITI_M45/LOW/infiniti_m45_01.jpg
http://www.statesmanclassifieds.com/autos/autoshow/images/reviews/infiniti_m4502.jpg

Looks like a KIA to me-a. No thanks. However, I like the G35 Sports Sedan.

G35 Sedan
http://imagesnissan2.free.fr/images/japon/infiniti/2001_g35_1.jpg
http://imagesnissan2.free.fr/images/japon/infiniti/2002_g35_2.jpg


More Pictures here (http://www.dieselstation.com/archive/G35Sedan/)

[KLang]

I haven't driven one yet but the new AWD Acura RL looks interesting. Lots of electonic toys if you like that sort of thing.

[RichK]

I like the Acura TL:
"The 270-horsepower, 3.2-liter TL is an advanced study in both, from its powerful 24-valve, VTEC® engine and 4-wheel independent double-wishbone suspension system, to an impressive console of sophisticated amenities, including Bluetooth™ wireless cell phone technology and Acura/ELS™ Premium 8-speaker Surround-Sound System with DVD-Audio. As with all Acura models, luxury and performance add up to miles of extreme exhilaration in the 2005 TL."

http://www.acura.com/images/tl/tl_gall_img_01.jpg

[Joe in LA]

M45
http://www.pdxguide.com/cars/2004/infiniti/M45.jpg
http://press.nissan-global.com/COMMON/IMAGES/CURRENT_US/INFINITI_M45/LOW/infiniti_m45_01.jpg
http://www.statesmanclassifieds.com/autos/autoshow/images/reviews/infiniti_m4502.jpg

Looks like a KIA to me-a. No thanks. However, I like the G35 Sports Sedan.

G35 Sedan
http://imagesnissan2.free.fr/images/japon/infiniti/2001_g35_1.jpg
http://imagesnissan2.free.fr/images/japon/infiniti/2002_g35_2.jpg


More Pictures here (http://www.dieselstation.com/archive/G35Sedan/)

I'd second the M45 if you are looking at a 5 series or E class, but the M45 above is not the car--wait a couple months for the new one. I have a G35 Coupe and love it. Everything I've read about the new M is that it is an improvement over the G.

[Jag_Warrior]

If reliability is what you're after, I don't think Mercedes would be the first choice. I don't remember the exact rankings, but for 2004, JD Power had Mercedes below Lexus (which I do remember was #1), BMW and several others. If I'm not mistaken, Mercedes was tied with Mitsubishi - both below the industry average for reliability. Mercedes has also taken some hits on resale value over the past few years.

I'd take into account what kinds of dealers/service centers are nearby. Then I'd check Consumer Reports or JD Power and try to narrow it down based on value and price. Then go to some dealers and drive the heck out of several different models. Never again will I buy a car based strictly on style or brand = expen$ive mistake ya gotta live with. I never ever thought I'd buy a wagon... but I've never been more pleased with an automobile purchase.

Tell us what you get when the decision is made.

[JoeBob]

The new C-Class is the automotive equivalent of a shark jump.

[Dirty Sanchez]

you won't get reliability from any over-engineered german car, imo.

I'm approaching 20k on my 04 and I haven't had anything strange happen. The transmission was out of the car for a few hours to fix a known TSB... back on the road the same day. Other than that... not one issue.

[devilmaster]

Ya know, a few years back, at the Detroit auto show, I caught a look at Vauxhall.

I know nothing about their quality or reliability, but I liked the look of some of their cars. This thread made me go lookin at their website - some nice things in there.

Steve

[RacinM3]

At the risk of sounding like a broken record:

http://media3.motorcities.com/02LCD503500967B.jpeg

BMW 330i Performance Package. Get the last of the E46 cars before Bangle ruins it with the new E90 3-Series. Story is BMW's offering a $3,800 dealer discount that can be passed on to the customer. If you haggle right with the dealer I've heard some will pass on all $3,800 to you. Available in 6-speed or auto (boo).

I also like the Acura option, and while I'm not a big fan of the new Mercedes quality, a buddy just picked up a C-Class car with sport package and a 6-speed. Pretty good looking little car.

[racer2c]

The new A6 is getting allot of good press.

[Gnam]

How's 'bout dis won?

http://216.117.199.231/Smart-Brabus/Smart-Brabus-002.jpg

[FCYTravis]

Get the last of the E46 cars before Bangle ruins it with the new E90 3-Series.
:laugh: :rofl: :cry:

Glad we bought our 2002 325Ci when we did...

[Winston Wolfe]

Nice job on the pics from Manic, but that is the OLD M45.... based on the Cedric platform from Japan.

The new M45 goes on sale this spring and they had it at the LA Auto Show. It is built on the FM platform, which can also house the M35 (nice 6cyl) and the M45 (V8).... this, as you may know, is the platform from the G35 Coupe & Sedan, the 350Z and the new M series cars. The engines are shared in the FX series as well (35 and 45), and it was a great looking car at the show.

you might be able to get by with an M35....

I would post or link pics, but I dont know how. Just go to the Infiniti.com website and I am sure you will find pics. The old M45 is cool, but the platform is old and heavy.

Another one to look at is a used 540i as a BMW Certified car. You get a great warranty up to 80k or 100k, and the cars are pretty solid. Mostly off-lease stuff that doesnt go to auction, and typically have low miles. They go through them at the dealership and you get a great warranty to boot.

My brother has a TL with the full blow A-Spec kit, which looks great and lowers the car a bit, with some really nice wheels and he upgraded the tires. But it is none too sharp off the line, but makes a great cruising car. It handles very well for a fwd sedan, but my '05 Accord V6 is faster off the line and my '88 M3 handles much better.

That's my two cents.... but its a penny for your thoughts.... who gets to keep the change ?

[nrc]

I still love the 2005 A4 but the depreciation kept me away.


Resale is one of the last things I worry about with a car. Either lease it and make the dealer guarantee the resale or drive it until the wheels fall off.

[nrc]

Friends don't let friends drive Fords.....

Smart friends ignore advice from friends who speak in silly cliches. :p

[Gnam]

2006 Infiniti M45

http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/15_m45_concept.jpg
http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/14_m45_concept.jpg
http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/09_m45_concept.jpg
http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/18_m45_concept.jpg
http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/21_m45_concept.jpg

Yeah, that looks better than the previous model. Here's some additional shots.

Image 01 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/01_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 02 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/02_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 03 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/03_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 04 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/04_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 05 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/05_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 06 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/06_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 07 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/07_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 08 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/08_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 10 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/10_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 11 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/11_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 12 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/12_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 13 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/13_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 16 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/16_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 17 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/17_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 19 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/19_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 20 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/20_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 22 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/22_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 23 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/23_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 24 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/24_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 25 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/25_m45_concept.jpg)

[Al Czervik]

Unfortunately, the closest Acura and Infiniti dealers are about 2 hrs away. Neither is a practical option for a daily driver.

[racer2c]

That M45 is bling bling and reminds me of another car, hmm what car is it? I think it start with a B and ends with a W.

[Gnam]

Unfortunately, the closest Acura and Infiniti dealers are about 2 hrs away. Neither is a practical option for a daily driver.

Is there a Lexus dealership nearby?

2006 GS 430
http://www.discountpartcenter.com/photos/05-01-04-01-Lexus-GS-430.jpg
http://www.discountpartcenter.com/photos/05-01-04-02-Lexus-GS-430.jpg
http://www.discountpartcenter.com/photos/05-01-04-03-Lexus-GS-430.jpg

Although, the IS 300 is closer to the same category as the Benz C-class.

[oddlycalm]

At the risk of sounding like a broken record:
BMW 330i Performance Package. Get the last of the E46 cars before Bangle ruins it with the new E90 3-Series. Story is BMW's offering a $3,800 dealer discount that can be passed on to the customer.Gotta agree with you on this. Our 2004 E46 is pretty close to the perfect car IMO. Reliable, powerful, great brakes and handling that is predictable right up to the limit and beyond. The performance package appearence is classic BMW as well. As much power as the E36 M3, but with hundreds of small refinements. The brakes on all E46's were upgraded to equal those on the M3 with 2004 models. If you can handle the limited rear seat legroom, it's hard to do better.

Lexus M45 (new version) - A full size luxocruiser. Nice looking car, but it competes with the Benz S class and BMW 7, not the E or 5.

Audi A6 - I like my A6 as a winter car, but the reliability reminds me it's a fancied up VW. Also, I've driven the new model and handling is the same bank-and-plane cornering which owes a lot more like my old 1963 Benz than a 2004 sport sedan. An A4 it is not.

Honda Accord Hybrid - Don't laugh until you drive one. Honda focused on who actually buys hybrid cars, then made it their premium version with a performance orientation. Grunt off the line feels more like an M3, not an Accord. Be prepared to sit on a waiting list for 6 months and pay the full $31K MSRP. I'm no Honda fan, but I'm also not going to lie about how well it works. A friend got one of the first ones sold, and I've got a couple hours behind the wheel. The gas engine is 250hp, the very strong AC electric engine has 100% of it's torque from nearly zero Rpm's and feels like it's out of an ALCO locomotive, and the car get 30mpg around town while doing it. The ultimate sleeper, and a performance car designed for our current fuel prices. It even comes with wider than standard tires. Only catch is you can't rev your engine at the stoplight to goad that kid in a slammed Civic into a race, because it's not running and you will be sitting there in eerie silence.... :D

oc

[Gnam]

Time to replace the '99 C-Class Merc.

Bimmer 5 series or another Merc?

Suggestions?
Back to the original question...

I have always prefered the styling of the Benz. However, BMW definately has the performance edge. I think the MB E320 3.2L 6-cyl AWD version would be a nice car to commute in. You can compare it to the 5 series and the A6 here. (http://www.edmunds.com/apps/nvc/edmunds/VehicleComparison?tid=edmunds.n.comparelanding.vdp comparator..6.Mercedes-Benz*&styleid=100477016&styleid=100477656&styleid=100395205&styleid=100425022&op=21&basestyleid=100444949)


http://a332.g.akamai.net/f/332/936/12h/www.edmunds.com//pictures/VEHICLE/2005/Mercedes-Benz/100396936/031111-E.jpg
http://a332.g.akamai.net/f/332/936/12h/www.edmunds.com//pictures/VEHICLE/2003/Mercedes-Benz/100173989/025945-E.jpg
http://a332.g.akamai.net/f/332/936/12h/www.edmunds.com//pictures/VEHICLE/2003/Mercedes-Benz/100173989/025944-E.jpg

[Spicoli]

Late to the party but...

I owned (leased) an IS300 and it rocked. I can 100% reccommend it, and I would have leased another one, but I got 2 rugrats to haul around now, and it wasn't practical. I paid ZERO down for 36/12 at 404 a month. If you;re into buying, I'd do that too. I just don;t commute far at all, and can therefore easily lease.

The 2005 FX4 F-150 SuperCrew is its replacement - FORD really did a nice job on this. The ride is awesome, and it flies. And take a listen to the stereo - Audiophile Option. w00t!

Other cars I've recently driven:

Ford Mustang GT (just yesterday): KICK ASS!
350Z: Kick ass
Magnum: I liked it, as na alternative to a truc, but its no sportscar at all.
BMW 5 series: I dig it, pocketbook does not.
Audi 4: :thumdown: (here's a hint: price an extended warranty on it)
Mazda RX-8: Drives incredibly, fits like a glove, fast and FUN (not a kid hauler)
Vovlo something or other: Volvos SUCK, Volvo should just quit making cars.
Saab something: Saab's suck too, pulled my buddy out of a ditch, POS.


Hope this confuses you further ;)

Seriously - what are the parameters you're looking at? AWD? 4 doors? mileage? Lease/Buy? Price?

[Winston Wolfe]

2006 Infiniti M45

http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/15_m45_concept.jpg
http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/14_m45_concept.jpg
http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/09_m45_concept.jpg
http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/18_m45_concept.jpg
http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/21_m45_concept.jpg

Yeah, that looks better than the previous model. Here's some additional shots.

Image 01 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/01_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 02 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/02_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 03 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/03_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 04 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/04_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 05 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/05_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 06 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/06_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 07 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/07_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 08 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/08_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 10 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/10_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 11 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/11_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 12 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/12_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 13 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/13_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 16 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/16_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 17 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/17_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 19 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/19_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 20 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/20_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 22 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/22_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 23 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/23_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 24 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/24_m45_concept.jpg)
Image 25 (http://www.nissannews.com/multimedia/concept2005/m45_concept/800px/25_m45_concept.jpg)


Damn, G-nam, you are the man.... or is it the"man-g"....

You got the pics up faster than 0-60 in that bad boy.
That is the rig I saw at the LA Auto show and it is every bit as good looking in person. The M35 option may work too.... lighter, better MPG, and about the same performance bang, for alot less ching$$$

The Accord Hybrid is a great rig, too.... like o-c says....total sleeper, gets GREAT MPGs and will pull like a mutha at about 1500RPM.... get some better rubber for the road, and you are moving, get the voice activated NAVI, and you are dialed in for the future with XM radio, instant traffic reports and just about any kind of music you would possibly want.

[Methanolandbrats]

Buy a Subaru STi. Comfy, goes like hell, does'nt cost much either. Much more fun than the other stuff in this thread.

[Ankf00]

I do like the M45, but the TL is freaking slick, I love the new one, plus the reliability for both those cars is just fine.

[nissan gtp]

Evo MR or STI for performance



Caddy if ya need comfort ;)

http://www.cadillac.com/images/models/ctsv/gallery/photoExt2_med.jpg

[Sean O'Gorman]

Having driven most of the cars in this thread, I feel the TL is what would be my pick. A definite improvement over the previous generation.

[Ankf00]

Having driven most of the cars in this thread, I feel the TL is what would be my pick. A definite improvement over the previous generation.
gran turismo doesn't count :gomer:

[Al Czervik]

Late to the party but...

I owned (leased) an IS300 and it rocked. I can 100% reccommend it, and I would have leased another one, but I got 2 rugrats to haul around now, and it wasn't practical. I paid ZERO down for 36/12 at 404 a month. If you;re into buying, I'd do that too. I just don;t commute far at all, and can therefore easily lease.

The 2005 FX4 F-150 SuperCrew is its replacement - FORD really did a nice job on this. The ride is awesome, and it flies. And take a listen to the stereo - Audiophile Option. w00t!

Other cars I've recently driven:

Ford Mustang GT (just yesterday): KICK ASS!
350Z: Kick ass
Magnum: I liked it, as na alternative to a truc, but its no sportscar at all.
BMW 5 series: I dig it, pocketbook does not.
Audi 4: :thumdown: (here's a hint: price an extended warranty on it)
Mazda RX-8: Drives incredibly, fits like a glove, fast and FUN (not a kid hauler)
Vovlo something or other: Volvos SUCK, Volvo should just quit making cars.
Saab something: Saab's suck too, pulled my buddy out of a ditch, POS.


Hope this confuses you further ;)

Seriously - what are the parameters you're looking at? AWD? 4 doors? mileage? Lease/Buy? Price?

Purchase, trade in the Benz. Max MSRP low to mid 50's. I have a Boxster for fun, so I prefer something to gobble up the miles w/out beating me up. Snow tires for the winter on the C-Class make it the best snow car I've had (we get the whole lake effect thing). Love the way German cars drive. No SUV's, aka station wagons.

Other possibilities...
300C - Nice, but slightly faddish styling. Reliability???
CTS or STS - On the list to drive, question long term quality/reliability.
Lexus - IS a little small, ES=35K Camary, GS getting long in tooth.
Acura/Infiniti/Jaguar - No local dealers.
Audi - see my previous posts
Saab - That is what you do after you buy one, sob.

Realistically, it will more than likely come down to C320, E320, or 530i. My current C has been dead nuts reliable (2 non-scheduled service stops in 92K miles, never stranded), but the Bimmer has been growing on me. I-Drive in the 5 controls a lot of set it once and forget it stuff.

[Winston Wolfe]

Al, do yourself a favor, and if you have a local FHonda dealership, give 'em a call and see if they have a Hybrid Accord.
You want a no-frills, get you through the snow, traction control, ABS, all the airbags you can handle, Voice activated NAVI unit, with great mileage, cant get pulled over looks, reliability like in a swiss watch, with a maintenance record that wont bust your balls, and a kick in the ass when you want to, just go ahead and try the Accord.
Yeah, they sold about 385K last year, just like the year before, and the year before that, and you see 'em on every 4 corner stop light, but goll darn it, that thing'll go faster than a chick trying to get out of O'Gorman's MR2 when he starts telling her about the "short shift kit" he installed on it.... :eek:
And you'll get as much as 38 MPG to boot....
Check it out before you buy anything else. :thumbup:

[chop456]

How about an E320 CDI?

[Brickman]

Buy the Merc... Although with the Acura, who needs a local dealer. They just run and run and run...

[Robstar]

If it's between the Mercspledes & the Beamer, I say go the Beams...

Webbo will be driving one in about 5 weeks :D

[Gnam]

The Cadillac CTS with the LS6 Corvette engine sounds like a winner to me. :thumbup: But no AWD for the snow. :thumdown:

As for the Acura TL, I can't get over the body line running down the side. They should have left it smooth.
http://www.modernracer.com/images/acuratlside1.jpg

And as for the BMW 5 Series, I just can't find an angle that makes the car look good.
http://www.bullz-eye.com/carreviews/2003%20images/bmw_5_series_325.jpg MORE PICS (http://www.bmwworld.com/media/wallpaper/e60_sedan.htm)


You could always base your decision on your F1 preferences:
Williams or McLaren?
Webber & Nick or JPM & Kimi?

[oddlycalm]

Hybrid Accord.
-snip-
You want a no-frills, get you through the snow, traction control, ABS, all the airbags you can handle, Voice activated NAVI unit, with great mileage, cant get pulled over looks, reliability like in a swiss watch, with a maintenance record that wont bust your balls, and a kick in the ass when you want to, just go ahead and try the Accord. Agreed. Interesting that Honda took the approach of making the hybrid the premium modal in the Accord line as well as the performance model. It shows they are paying attention to who actually buys hybrids.

A friend of mine bought one of the first Accord hybrids to arrive here, and I've driven it on two different occasions. It has wider tires than other Accords and it is seriously fast, although not quite approaching M3 acceleration levels. Not only is the 250hp V6 very healthy, but the permanent magnet AC motor feels like it was lifted out of an ALCO locomotive. You can know intellectually that the electric motor has nearly 100% of it's torque from zero Rpm, but you still won't be prepared for the actual effect when you drive it.

The brakes are not quite equal to the current BMW 3 series, and the handling is not quite at the same level either, but both are close, and more than acceptable for a sporty 4 door sedan. The electric motor and batteries only add 200lbs., about half of what a convertible top would add, so it's not like this is a heavy feeling car.

This is the ultimate sleeper right down to the sound cues. Instead of revving the engine at a stop light this car is totally silent right up until the moment you blow the doors off of kid with the slammed Civic with the coffee can muffler next to you... ;) And, you get a very real 30mpg in town while driving it irresponsibly as you care to. I know that they quote 38mpg, but that's with Aunt Mabel driving it. My friend gets 30mpg while driving the wheels off of it around town.

As most here know, I'm no Honda fan and have never bought one of their cars, but this is a car I would actually consider owning, something that I've never before said about another Honda. Be prepared to spend six months on a waiting list and pay the full $31K MSRP.

oc

[Gnam]

Interesting that Honda took the approach of making the hybrid the premium modal in the Accord line as well as the performance model. It shows they are paying attention to who actually buys hybrids.

oc
From what I understand, Honda hopes to offer hybrid engines as an option on all it's vehicles. That way the same car can attact people who like hybrids and people who just want a regular car. Unlike Toyota's approach with the Prius, where the hybrid is MADE to look different.

I've also heard Honda has a 300hp hybrid. Maybe they'll put that in an NSX?

[Winston Wolfe]

As most here know, I'm no Honda fan and have never bought one of their cars, but this is a car I would actually consider owning, something that I've never before said about another Honda. Be prepared to spend six months on a waiting list and pay the full $31K MSRP.

oc

Dealers here in SoCal are getting $3k-5k OVER window on these cars since they were released in early December. They have cool wheels, but "sacrificial" rubber.... get some decent shoes on that thing, maybe even some real suspensiond mods and you can even upgrade the pads, and I think you've got the ultimate sleeper.
There aren't any waiting lists if you want to pay OVER.... but sticker is only 1-3 months down here.
There was a rumor that ALL Hybrids were going to be let into the Carpool lane with single occupants, which set off a frenzy of purchases down here. Only to find out that it only applies to vehicles which achieve a minimum of 45 MPG highway. Sadly, the Accord Hyb falls short, but it is would have been the fastest one in the carpool lane, that is fo' sho'...
This is the sign of things to come with Honda. Next generation Civic is due out in the Fall. I "have heard" that they are attempting to create the first production car that will get uo to 800 miles on one tank of gas (the next Civic Hybrid). The current Accord can go up to 655 miles. My buddy has an Insight for his District Mgr gig, and he regularly scores over 550 miles per tank, and it costs his about $21 to fill up. :D The company reimburses him 11 cents per mile, so that thing is actually MAKING him money as he drives it...
Gotta love that technology ! :thumbup:

[chop456]

It's good that this technology is finally getting some people to talk about new cleaner diesels, too. All the mileage standards you mention can be surpassed by a car costing 1/3 less, and it can run on American grown/made biodiesel fuel, too. Ending subsidies, cleaner air, good for your car and 0% foriegn. And in typical California fashion, you can't buy one there. :shakehead

I shudder to think what hybrid batteries will cost to replace, and how they're disposed of. Do the manufacturers have any kind of open-ended warranty on the electric portion of the system?

That said, the Accord looks really nice.

[nrc]

If Uncle Sam doesn't take a big bite we'll probably be in the market next month. A Mini Cooper S is the most likely candidate, but an RX8 might sneak into the garage if I find a dealer willing to unload a 2004 cheaply enough.

[Winston Wolfe]

If Uncle Sam doesn't take a big bite we'll probably be in the market next month. A Mini Cooper S is the most likely candidate, but an RX8 might sneak into the garage if I find a dealer willing to unload a 2004 cheaply enough.


Out here in SoCal, the RX-8s are stacking up deep, and dealers are selling 'em cheap....

Go to any of the online buying services and find a dealership in your area who is dropping his pants and giving their stuff away. heck, its winter time, you are ass deep in snow, and they are trying to sell RWD sports cars ???? Sounds like : Advantage - CUSTOMER ! to me...
Remember, paying flooring on a $30,000 car aint peanuts, and if they are sitting for 2,3,4, months or more, that starts to add up, and eat into the gross profit of the dealer.
Game, set, match - CUSTOMER wins !

[Ankf00]

looks like a miata rx-8 match made in Ohio to me ;)

[Winston Wolfe]

I shudder to think what hybrid batteries will cost to replace, and how they're disposed of. Do the manufacturers have any kind of open-ended warranty on the electric portion of the system?

That said, the Accord looks really nice.

Battery packs have not really been "worn out" yet, and AFAIK there are no real warranty issues with them, as of yet, since the first Hybrid was sold back in Dec '99 when Honda sold the first Insight.... I do know that they have an 8 year \ 80K warranty against manufacturer DEFECTS, not just wearing out.... and I know two people who have a Hybrid and really enjoy all of the savings aspects (money \ fuel \ environment).
Estimated cost to replace the battery pack (not the charging system) as a warranty item is approx $8,200. Rest assured, Honda and Toyota are NOT making a dime when they sell these things to consumers. They are doing it for the the "halo" effect.
That said, I have not yet heard about one being involved in a major accident where the battery may become broken, or damaged severely....
Also dont know of any really high mileage cars that have simply seen their last day... all in due time.... we'll soon find out !

[nrc]

Out here in SoCal, the RX-8s are stacking up deep, and dealers are selling 'em cheap....

Go to any of the online buying services and find a dealership in your area who is dropping his pants and giving their stuff away. heck, its winter time, you are ass deep in snow, and they are trying to sell RWD sports cars ???? Sounds like : Advantage - CUSTOMER ! to me...
Remember, paying flooring on a $30,000 car aint peanuts, and if they are sitting for 2,3,4, months or more, that starts to add up, and eat into the gross profit of the dealer.
Game, set, match - CUSTOMER wins !

We'll see how it works out. I'm a greedy miser and I'm still deciding whether I want to renew my RWD adventure here in the Winter Wonderland.

The cool thing is that you can go on the Mazda web site and see exactly what the dealer inventory is for each model. There are 23 six speed 2004 RX8's within 50 miles. :)

[chop456]

Winston, do you know anything about whether or not Honda did any real world mileage testing before they released the MPG numbers for the Accord? I know that both Honda and Toyota got a major spanking from the EPA a few months ago because their estimates for the Prius, Insight and Civic were wildly out of whack with what people were actually getting.

[G.]

I also heard that the mileage isn't very good on the highway with the hybrids, that the technology is better for city driving.

If I'm wrong on that, then the FHonda looks pretty damn good!

[Winston Wolfe]

you have to make an effort to get the MPG claims that the EPA test allows the manufacturers to get....
My buddy with the Insight averaged, that's right AVERAGED, 82 MPG coming from Hesperia back to OC last week. Calls me to tell me, so I claim Bull**** ! But I see him Monday, and he shows me the trip odomoter for "Trip B" and sho' nuff, it registered ! Granted that is a decline from Hesperia, and going 70 MPH is pretty much perfect speed.
I followed him back from SD when we first got him the car, and going 75-80 weaving in and out of traffic on the 5 N he averaged 62 MPG.... My Accord V6 averaged 24MPG and he pretty much maintained pace with me.

G. - you're right. The initial application was to assist in gettnig the car off the line under maximum acceleration, using a high torque motor assist powered by battery. The thing shuts off at 1800 - 2100 RPM, and you are on gas power only from then on. The difference with the Prius is that it will sometimes propel you on ELECTRIC only. The Honda will never use just electric power. I can tell you that I drove a Civic Hybrid for two weeks, drove it like a complete madman, back and forth to SD and all over OC for the time period, and even I could manage to average 42 MPG. I couldnt stop talking about it. If you work at it a little bit, and work with a light throttle, and can stay at constant speeds on the freeway, then I believe you can exceed the EPA ratings in many real world situations.

I just love the fact that FHonda has decided to make the Accord Hybrid a performance model instead of just getting more MPG. :thumbup:

[Spicoli]

If Uncle Sam doesn't take a big bite we'll probably be in the market next month. A Mini Cooper S is the most likely candidate, but an RX8 might sneak into the garage if I find a dealer willing to unload a 2004 cheaply enough.

Find somebody who works for Ford, or a dealership. Get a discount pass from them - 3% below invoice.
;)

You'd be surprised who "Reasonable" that price can get. :eek:

[Spicoli]

looks like a miata rx-8 match made in Ohio to me ;)

Miata is a sissyboy car.

[KLang]

I also heard that the mileage isn't very good on the highway with the hybrids, that the technology is better for city driving.

If I'm wrong on that, then the FHonda looks pretty damn good!

They claim 37 highway. Thought I read somewhere that at highway speed the engine shuts down half the cylinders to conserve fuel.

[nrc]

Miata is a sissyboy car.

I love our sissyboy car. :D

[Al Czervik]

Just a followup. '06 Merc E350 on its way!

[racer2c]

Just a followup. '06 Merc E350 on its way!

Sweet. Will you adopt me? :)

[Audi_A4]

I love our sissyboy car. :D
I had a 1991 Sissyboycar for 8 years,and loved it .... sold it for an A4

[Winston Wolfe]

I had a 1991 Sissyboycar for 8 years,and loved it .... sold it for an A4


That's just cuz "sissyboycar" would have been a ****ty handle here on OC :D :rofl:

..... thanks, I'll be here all night.... try the meatloaf, and tip your servers !

[Gnam]

Just a followup. '06 Merc E350 on its way!
http://www.mbusa.com/media/images/main/models/gallery/photo_gallery/e/sedan_2_main.jpg

Nice. :thumbup:
What color did ya get?

[Al Czervik]

http://www.mbusa.com/media/images/main/models/gallery/photo_gallery/e/sedan_2_main.jpg

Nice. :thumbup:
What color did ya get?

Brilliant Silver w/ Charcoal interior.

[Al Czervik]

One last bump. Took delivery yesterday. This effer is BUILT. Very German, in all the right ways. I wish there was an Autobahn nearby!

[JohnnyQ]

Brilliant Silver w/ Charcoal interior.

Very nice. Make sure you wear those nubbys off the sides of the tires. ;)