"Real" Dodge Charger vs. "NASCAR" Dodge Charger

[rabbit]

http://www.speedtv.com/_assets/library/img/large/51108_dch.jpg

The resemblance is uncanny. :rolleyes:

Stock cars my @#$.

[pchall]

I remember when manufacturers had to turn out 500 street worthy cars with the same body work that fit the template. I actually paid attention to NASCAR then. Nothing like seeing a Superbird or a Torino Talladega next to you at the stop light.

[devilmaster]

I don't see what everyone is complaining about........

.....the logos are the same.

Steve

[NismoZ]

Isn't this the shape of NASCAB's new "safety car"? Aren't they pretty much all going to look alike? (more than now) Try fitting a Camry into that profile!

[racer2c]

I think the artist conception is being very generous to the stock car, uh, I mean the race car, well the car on the left that is. When it debuts, I'm willing to bet it won't have such a pronounced front end.

I'm diggin' the sedan though. Tough like the Magnum but without looking like a hearse. I'm so sick of Toyota and Honda design every where I look.

[Al Czervik]

I want a share of the duct tape sales for that massive grill opening. :D

[Skater_36]

I remember when manufacturers had to turn out 500 street worthy cars with the same body work that fit the template. I actually paid attention to NASCAR then. Nothing like seeing a Superbird or a Torino Talladega next to you at the stop light.

The engines used in the race cars also had to be sold in production cars. Remember the Boss 429, the various hemi cars and other "specials" that used to hit the streets with aero bodywork and big engines?

[pchall]

The engines used in the race cars also had to be sold in production cars. Remember the Boss 429, the various hemi cars and other "specials" that used to hit the streets with aero bodywork and big engines?


Oh, yes. My dad bought a Camaro for my older sister when she graduated from high school that came with a different set of headers, a ducktail spoiler, and something that looked like leaf spring shackles in the trunk and some other stuff packaged in the trunk. She hated the car because of the stiff ride and the heavy clutch. In months he sold it to a USAF buddy who was happy to get a Z28 with very low miles.

[Winston Wolfe]

The engines used in the race cars also had to be sold in production cars. Remember the Boss 429, the various hemi cars and other "specials" that used to hit the streets with aero bodywork and big engines?


I recall my Dad had a 1970 Torino Cobra with a 428\ 429 SCJ engine, which had to be built so that they could race the car to keep up with the MOPAR products running in NASCAR. I believe Richard Petty even drove a Torino Cobra in 1970 after leaving Plymouth over some issue in 1969....
I also recall Dad's car being REAL fast, and he used to run it at the old Fremont Raceway in NoCal, and then again at Lions Drag Strip down here in SoCal...
Todays NASCAR products are so far from the "real thing" that is just goes to show you that PT Barnum wasn't so far off, even all those years ago !

[Andrew Longman]

I actually don't have much of a problem with them not being "stock". As people have pointed out, in the good ol' days the rules were really a joke anyway. They said you needed to produce 500 cars and I recall GM (I think it was) admitting later that when the NASCAR folks came to inspect them they rolled the same 50 cars in and out the the building until the NASCAR folks counted to 500.

Anyway, they are safer today and not anymore unstock than Modifieds running at the local track for the last 35 years.

What I do have a problem with are fans rooting for a decal thinking that Ford, or Chevy or Dodge have anything really to do with the car except money. They have little more to do with it than Pfizer, Kodak, or Kelloggs.

Woohoo! Go Viagra!

[Steve99]

I'm stilly trying to decide which of those 2 car is uglier. :thumdown: :cry:

[Jag_Warrior]

I recall GM (I think it was) admitting later that when the NASCAR folks came to inspect them they rolled the same 50 cars in and out the the building until the NASCAR folks counted to 500.

Five hunert?! Dang, that's a bunch of finger & toe countin'!

[Railbird]

The bad part of homogulation rules is you end up with dealer's lots full of weird **** like this:

http://www.thingsthatgo.ca/funstuff/events/cruise-in/photos/IM000025.JPG

[tllips]

Hey! I had an SSP (or is that SST) car of that model except it was purple. IT was my favorite SSP car. You know, they had a big wheel in the center and you pulled the plastic cord thing to make it go. then they flew down the driveway!!! :D

Link to Picture (I couldn't find one last night) (http://www.timewarptoys.com/sstocker.jpg)

[racer2c]

I used to dream about owning a Superbird and I don't like the word 'homogulation'. :)

[Railbird]

I'm thinkin' you spent about as much time in English Lit as I did wandering car lots checking out shabby cars.

[racer2c]

I'm thinkin' you spent about as much time in English Lit as I did wandering car lots checking out shabby cars.

Just very defensive of my Mopars. Isn't 'homogulation' some kind of man orgy?

[Racewriter]

I recall my Dad had a 1970 Torino Cobra with a 428\ 429 SCJ engine, which had to be built so that they could race the car to keep up with the MOPAR products running in NASCAR. I believe Richard Petty even drove a Torino Cobra in 1970 after leaving Plymouth over some issue in 1969....

Nope. The 429 SCJ engine in the '70 Torino was not the Boss 429 engine, nor was it built for (or ever raced in) NASCAR. They shared the block architecture and crankshafts, but that was it. The 429 SCJ was a standard 429/460 engine with bigger head ports.

The NASCAR Boss 429 was only offered in Mustangs in '69 and '70, with 500 built in '69, and 600 or so in '70.

Also, the "styled with the wind" '70 Torinos ended up being bad enough aerodynamically that Ford teams used '69 Torinos and Mercurys until they were obsoleted by the rules after the '71 season. Then the Ford teams mainly used '72 Torinos or '71 Mercurys.

Petty ran a Ford in '69 when Plymouth wouldn't build an equivalent to the Charger 500 (which wasn't enough, thus the Daytona). The Superbird was built to get Petty back to Mopar. Although Dodge only built 501 Daytonas, Plymouth built over 1,000 Superbirds - thus the greater 'Bird frequency at car shows.

[Rob]

Here are a couple pics from tire testing last September:

http://www.jayski.com/schemes/2005/cup/2005---dodge2-huge.jpg

http://www.jayski.com/schemes/2005/cup/2005---dodge3-huge.jpg

Egad...

[racer2c]

Here are a couple pics from tire testing last September:

http://www.jayski.com/schemes/2005/cup/2005---dodge2-huge.jpg

http://www.jayski.com/schemes/2005/cup/2005---dodge3-huge.jpg

Egad...

I remember those. Horrid, horrid race car. Like a platapus.

[Cam]

I remember those. Horrid, horrid race car. Like a platapus.

WTF is wrong with the platypus??? :p

[racer2c]

WTF is wrong with the platypus??? :p

I just cvan't win and to think I was an English major. :) :cry:

[chop456]

I'm stilly trying to decide which of those 2 car is uglier. :thumdown: :cry:

At least you can turn the TV off to avoid looking at one of them.

Good lord. At least they got the Crossfire 1/2 right.

[Skater_36]

Nope. The 429 SCJ engine in the '70 Torino was not the Boss 429 engine, nor was it built for (or ever raced in) NASCAR. They shared the block architecture and crankshafts, but that was it. The 429 SCJ was a standard 429/460 engine with bigger head ports.

The NASCAR Boss 429 was only offered in Mustangs in '69 and '70, with 500 built in '69, and 600 or so in '70.

Also, the "styled with the wind" '70 Torinos ended up being bad enough aerodynamically that Ford teams used '69 Torinos and Mercurys until they were obsoleted by the rules after the '71 season. Then the Ford teams mainly used '72 Torinos or '71 Mercurys.

Petty ran a Ford in '69 when Plymouth wouldn't build an equivalent to the Charger 500 (which wasn't enough, thus the Daytona). The Superbird was built to get Petty back to Mopar. Although Dodge only built 501 Daytonas, Plymouth built over 1,000 Superbirds - thus the greater 'Bird frequency at car shows.

You seem to have a pretty good handle on 70's era muscle cars so maybe you can help me out.

A friends family had a 1969-1971 Torino convertible (I'm pretty sure it was a 70) which I believe was a Shelby because it had the Shelby style roll bar. The car was dark blue with a white interior and white top, 4 speed with a 428 or 429 and a real shaker hood scoop. The car had cobra emblems on the lower front fenders and possibly on the rear between the tailights. I know someone that approached the family about buying the car about 20 years ago but they wouldn't sell even though the car just sat under a tarp. The family has since moved and the car disappeared. I've never been able to find any information about other Torinos like that one.

Do you or anyone else know of any cars like the one I described or a place to find information about them?

[pchall]

WTF is wrong with the platypus??? :p

it's really hard to drink beer from a can with a duckbill :p

[NismoZ]

Well, who the hell would manufacture a can with a duckbill!? Sort of a "Tommy Tippy" for late evening drinkers? :)

[pinniped]

They were showing the new Dodge Nascar "template" (aren't they all a spec body by now) on speed channel and it looks far more like the other cars than the picture here...the grill opening is much smaller and the upper half is slanted backward, not vertical or near vertical like on the production car...

[nrc]

Ugh. They'd have been better off just staying with the headlight stickers instead of grafting a proboscis on.

http://forums.autoweek.com/servlet/JiveServlet/download/31-10420-219702-1663/2005_charger_newman2.jpg

[oddlycalm]

I remember when manufacturers had to turn out 500 street worthy cars with the same body work that fit the template. I actually paid attention to NASCAR then. Yeah, me too. They lost their way when they set out to market to women and non-racefans. The disconnect from current automotive reality has made the cars anachronistic cartoons marketed to people that have no real interest in owning actual performance cars, let alone doing high performance driving themselves.

The performance import phenomena is totally disconnected from any racing series (the biggest missed motorsports opportunity of our time), and folks my age that want high performance street iron they can use for track events mostly have Porsches, BMW's and Corvettes.

oc

[Winston Wolfe]

Ugh. They'd have been better off just staying with the headlight stickers instead of grafting a proboscis on.

http://forums.autoweek.com/servlet/JiveServlet/download/31-10420-219702-1663/2005_charger_newman2.jpg


NRC, one thing I really enjoy about your posts, is that I get to learn a new word.... today's lesson is proboscis.... so I looked on the net and found.

1. A long flexible snout or trunk, as of an elephant.
2. The slender, tubular feeding and sucking organ of certain invertebrates, such as insects, worms, and mollusks.
3. A human nose, especially a prominent one.

"ya learn sumpin' new, every day".... :)

[RobGuru]

What? NASCAR getting styling cues from G-Force now? That's quite a proboscis!

[racer2c]

That car is almost as ugly as the GA DP's. That is some serious uglyness.

[Andrew Longman]

"The slender, tubular feeding and sucking organ of certain invertebrates"

Careful, we're in the family hour :rofl:

[Rogue Leader]

That car is almost as ugly as the GA DP's. That is some serious uglyness.

that is 5000000000000000 times uglier than a DP

[racer2c]

that is 5000000000000000 times uglier than a DP

250000000000000 maybe. The greenhouses on the DP's I saw on Speed News last night were big enough for a BioShere experiment, but I'm not going there. :)

[Michaelhatesfans]

Ugh. They'd have been better off just staying with the headlight stickers instead of grafting a proboscis on.
And just think, if it has any advantage at all, the Fords and Chevys will be allowed to use them as well. :thumdown:

[Michaelhatesfans]

http://forums.autoweek.com/servlet/JiveServlet/download/31-10420-219702-1663/2005_charger_newman2.jpg


http://www.autonews.com/images/random/011005/det844568244rsunmon/chargertoo430.jpg

:saywhat:

[pinniped]

250000000000000 maybe. The greenhouses on the DP's I saw on Speed News last night were big enough for a BioShere experiment, but I'm not going there. :)


Those weren't the DP's...that was a new class they are running called "spec AMC Pacer"...

[rabbit]

http://forums.autoweek.com/servlet/JiveServlet/download/31-10420-219702-1663/2005_charger_newman2.jpg
http://www.autonews.com/images/random/011005/det844568244rsunmon/chargertoo430.jpg

Wow. That's worse than my original post. Notice the glaring lack of a proboscis on the original. :gomer:

[racer2c]

What the deal with ugly racecars these days. Seems to be all the rage. I can't believe that the chassis guys didn't step back and say "that's a damn ugly car". I guess it's working for them in the wind tunnel.

[nrc]

NRC, one thing I really enjoy about your posts, is that I get to learn a new word.... today's lesson is proboscis.... so I looked on the net and found.

Learning is Fundamental! :D

[devilmaster]

Now I know, and knowing is half the battle..........

Steve