If I see one more...

[Sean O'Gorman]

...GM ad that uses a classic rock song to try and sell their crap, I'm seriously going to vomit. It absolutely amazes me that more consumers don't equate using 60s-70s music with lack of forward thinking, and I'm getting sick of song after song getting ruined by them.

I did, however, drive the new STS today, and I was very impressed. Of course, if I could afford one, I'd probably just spend the money on racing instead. :D

[SteveH]

What about the 'new' Mustang ad that resurrected Steve McQueen? Nothing is original anymore. Everything from here on out is recycled. What a boring life we'll have Want proof? Look at the IRL, it is what CART was four years ago. :gomer:

[Sean O'Gorman]

What about the 'new' Mustang ad that resurrected Steve McQueen? Nothing is original anymore. Everything from here on out is recycled. What a boring life we'll have Want proof? Look at the IRL, it is what CART was four years ago. :gomer:

Good point. While the Mustang is very cool, I don't think that Ford's retro strategy is very wise. Same with DaimlerChrysler, with the Hemi, Charger, 300C etc. Can't any of the American manufacturers show some sign of forward thinking?

[Warlock!]

They're not tryin' to sell these vehicles to people like you, Sean... the money resides in my age bracket. Unfortunately, it's not in my wallet.

Of course the ads don't really trip my trigger either... but I don't think they could come up with an effective marketing gimmick for Slayer's Angel of Death, War Ensemble, or South of Heaven.

Warlock!

[indyfan31]

.... Can't any of the American manufacturers show some sign of forward thinking?

Yeah, why can't they be more like the Japanese .... and just copy the Europeans. :shakehead

[racer2c]

Good point. While the Mustang is very cool, I don't think that Ford's retro strategy is very wise. Same with DaimlerChrysler, with the Hemi, Charger, 300C etc. Can't any of the American manufacturers show some sign of forward thinking?

As a 20 year amateur analyst of the auto industry and the products they create, it amazes me that retro is still so 'in' (and I'm a huge fan of it myself). But it really boils down to the demographics that the industry believes to be their cash cow, namely the babyboomers and their kids (which I'm one of, all of us 30 somethings). Nostalgia is big business and I'm pretty sure in 20 years, car shows will have plenty of lowered Civics with 19"s and the guys will say "that's just like the one I had". The guys buying the Hemi Rams with the Cuda strobe vinyl are my age and older and love the thought of having the Hemi that they never could get in their Cuda in high school.

Some retro, properly blended with modern lines can be quite good, like the Chysler Crossfire IMO. Some are horrid like the Chevy SST and that London Taxi called the PT Cruiser.

In the mid 90's Ford introduced a design theme called The Edge. Ushered in with the prototype GT 90, this was to be Fords corporate wide "new age" of design. The anti curve design helped rid the world of some extremely ugly cars. This was Fords counter to the tremendously popular retro theme at Chrysler with their Prowler, PT Cruiser, Viper, and retro doo dads that were glued to their fleet cars. Well, The Edge did help some in my opinion. No longer did I have to turn my head every time I saw a catfish shaped '97 Taurus. The Edge helped straighten up the Mustang and the Dr. Seuss F150. But, Ford never pushed The Edge far enough in my opinion. Instead, they saw how every car magazine drooled over all things Viper/Prowler and PT Cruiser and decided that a GT40 limited edition would get some press thrown their way. Retro, the easy way out for car companies, the SST is a prime example. At least Chrysler makes retro their 'thing'. Chevy's seems to design without rhyme or reason.

Personally, I'm fine with not rushing tomorrow’s designs into today. I went to one car show here in DC where they had the first Scion bX on display. The speaker said that this car was designed by asking five year olds what shapes they liked because the company wanted to start early in making brand loyalty and that this was the 'shape' of cars to come because that's what the kids like. Great. So the cars of the future will be squares, triangles and circles. How evolutionary.
:rolleyes:

[oddlycalm]

Can't any of the American manufacturers show some sign of forward thinking? GM and Ford are run by financial guys and managers that are not car guys. These are corporate cultures of conformity and any creative thinkers and high powered doers are squeezed out as soon as they appear rather than rewarded. When you enforce conformity and turn a blind eye to mediocrity, all the while stifling creativity, you get a company that looks exactly like GM. Ford had the added dimension of some nasty purges that extended down into middle management during some of the regime changes during the 60's and 70's just to make sure everyone felt uneasy and negative.

The real problem is that guys like Henry Ford, Willy Durant and Walter Chrysler would never get hired by these companies today, and if they did they wouldn't last a year. A lot of people rise to power, but few ever rise to greatness or build anything of enduring value. Roger Smith had power, but in the decade he ran GM they went from the lowest cost producer in the industry to the highest cost and lost 12% of their market share into the bargain. Some of us remember with GM's market share was 56% of the market during the late 60's when they also all but owned the major appliance business and had a big piece of the military vehicle business.

These companies simply have nothing to attract the best and brightest so it's no surprise that the best don't go to work there and those that do and show promise get recruited for advanced degree programs and better jobs elsewhere. But hey, the GT40 was way cool... back in 1967. And it was great that the Mustang got independent suspension only 30yrs after it's foreign competition. :( :shakehead

oc

[B3RACER1a]

You guys are dead on. :thumbup:

[Ankf00]

sheesh.

haters.

that SST is the finest piece of engineering since the Edsel!!!!

[oddlycalm]

All GM has to do is to let Holden VST, Vauxhall and Opel design it's future cars and it would do fine and could save significant money. They could keep a small design staff in Michigan to design vehicles to satisfy Bubba and the land yachts favored for floating over the frost heaved concrete slab freeways in the flyover states. Trying to push their over-isolated floaters on the bulk of the population that no longers lives in the snow belt has been a losing strategy for the last 30 or so model years, so just maybe it's time to try something new.

Oh, and the 50% of their customers that have abandoned them over the last 30yrs have voted with their wallets on the issue of whether or not all small cars are econoboxes. It still hasn't dawned on these yucks that a loaded Mini costs as much as a loaded Buick and that there has been a waiting list to get a Mini while Buicks have to be blown out at give away margins. Their answer is to build Saturns, and car that virtually shouts boring...

oc

[Ankf00]

in GM's defense, or lack of defense, that GTO is a Holden, and that GTO is a whale.

No one can save them, no one.

[Robstar]

in GM's defense, or lack of defense, that GTO is a Holden, and that GTO is a whale.

But based on a classic... :)

http://members2.easyspace.com/hotholdens/assets/images/hk-monaro.jpg

http://hellcity.candysweet.com/cars_big_stmarys_04.jpg

[Michaelhatesfans]

...GM ad that uses a classic rock song to try and sell their crap, I'm seriously going to vomit. It absolutely amazes me that more consumers don't equate using 60s-70s music with lack of forward thinking, and I'm getting sick of song after song getting ruined by them.

I've still got a bad twitch from hearing The Clash being used in a Jag commercial a few years ago. :saywhat:

[Jervis Tetch 1]

I've still got a bad twitch from hearing The Clash being used in a Jag commercial a few years ago. :saywhat:The Clash's "Should I Stay or Should I Go?" is still being used now. I just forget who the company is.

[Sean O'Gorman]

The Clash's "Should I Stay or Should I Go?" is still being used now. I just forget who the company is.

GM, of course. Pontiac G6. :rolleyes:

[Ankf00]

"If I see one more..."
AP writer voting Texas 9th below IOWA and BOISE I'm going to hurl a crapwagon at race speed at him/her *grumblemobilealabamahickwritergrumble* :mad:

and all marketing reps that try to buy rights to these songs to pimp their crap ought to be rounded up and sent to Leavenworth, it's just unholy

[Ziggy]

I have stayed away from commenting on the Steve McQueen Mustang commercials.

I think it's lame. Maybe a once in a while deal, SuperBowl style, but to show it over and over shows a lack of innovation on Ford's part.

It's a shame really, as the car has alot of positive styling points IMO. The windshield wiper well is too deep and appears unfinished to me. I spent about ten minutes under one yesterday as my work is giving one away tomorrow.

Appears well built, but seam sealer everywhere. Very nice rear antiroll bar, which appears to be lightweight (not big enough in diameter to do you any good) Exhaust system on this one was stainless, with vey nice hangers which were welded in place. When it goes, so goes your savings account. Standard ancient rear end (hey, what do you want for 28K). I really like the door handles and the A pillars. The car is true to the 1967 Mustang lines in many reguards.

If I win it, Im keeping it!

Ziggy