Don't they like Ralph Schumacher? [Archive]

skibum

06-20-04, 03:21 PM

I guess the Dr was at pit out because they said he had to make a complete lap. But where the h... was the ambulance going. I guess he wanted to take a lap also.

Rob

06-20-04, 03:29 PM

Rogue Leader

06-20-04, 03:31 PM

Safety vehicles are prohibited from going around the wrong way on a circuit. Still, you'd think they'd have some sort of shortcut for them to make a beeline to the hospital.

The whole way they handled the crash was disgraceful. Leaving Ralf unattended for that long is unforgiveable. :thumdown:

See IMO thats ridiculous especially on a wide track like this where theres plenty of room for the ambulance to be safely out of the way and hopefully good coordination between the safety car and safety crews to do somethng like that. Especially if it could have been a life or death situation...

j_d

06-20-04, 03:41 PM

I mentioned this in another thread, but I was apoplectic during the interminable wait for the medical car. I thought that was handled poorly, but I liked the nice shout out by the announcers about the speed with which the safety team reacts in Champ Car events

RacinM3

06-20-04, 05:11 PM

Can you imagine if Zanardi had to wait that long after his life-threatening crash? The thought is chilling.

stroker

06-20-04, 06:38 PM

Are we to believe that they have only ONE safety team? Looks like Bernie gets to spend some more money....

Elmo T

06-20-04, 08:41 PM

Can you imagine if Zanardi had to wait that long after his life-threatening crash? The thought is chilling.

I thought the same thing. Seconds actually do matter in some cases. It took far too long.

What I don't know is how they decide when to send the medical and/or the safety car. I've seen shunts that appear more serious without a response from either. Drivers hop out and they drag the wreckage off the circuit. There is not the immediate response as in Champcar (or the IRL for that matter) where the safety teams know the yellow is out and they are moving.

As I see it, Ralph hits the wall and someone is watching a monitor waiting to see if he is ready to climb out. Tick-Tock Tick-Tock. "OK... I guess we better send them..." They should do better. :thumdown:

Tall1

06-20-04, 08:41 PM

Not to detract from the seriousness of the event, but, since the ambulance could only go with the flow of traffic, and RS was on board the ambulance, will he get credit for completing that lap?

Railbird

06-20-04, 09:26 PM

While I think the Indy configuration presents somewhat of a challenge I can't imagine why they don't have a quick response team stationed along the pit wall.

That deal was both scary and disgraceful.

Who will be sitting in that sled for the British GP?

I've heard the phone is already ringing

Cam

06-20-04, 10:15 PM

I've heard the phone is already ringing

Really???? Do tell! More than the bruised back that we have be told so for? Or is the bruised ego more like it? ;)

Railbird

06-20-04, 10:29 PM

I've been told his bell was well and truly rung.

Past performance considered, there may be a seat available at Silverstone.

Amanda B.'s Mom

06-21-04, 12:18 AM

Are we to believe that they have only ONE safety team? Looks like Bernie gets to spend some more money....

1. Aren;t there several ambulances/safety teams at most US champ Car Road/ Street Circuits?

1. a. Aren;t there "shortcuts/access roads" for those vehicles to travel on to get to an accident quicker that running almost a full lap?

2. I am very glad that Ralph did not suffer the fate that many of the IRL drivers have suffered at the hand of TG "safety in racing" ideals.

theunions

06-21-04, 12:24 AM

Who will be sitting in that sled for the British GP?

I've heard the phone is already ringing

If not Ralf, why would it be anyone but Gene?

fourrunner

06-21-04, 12:45 AM

I've been told his bell was well and truly rung.

Past performance considered, there may be a seat available at Silverstone.

After watchiong the rerun of the accident, It was quite obvious that he was unconscious immediately at the hit and for a short time after... Just because you've regained consciousness doesn't mean damage wasn't done.

A Neighborhood kid got his "Bell Rung" in a football accident a few years ago, and regained consciousness and seemed just fine until 3 days later when he dropped dead at school .... they concluded that the "hit" had caused an anuerism which they did not detect, and since the parents had given in to the kids protestations that " I'm Fine, can we go home now" against the doctors advise... He was told to come back in a couple days, but didn't !

formulaben

06-21-04, 02:11 AM

Can you imagine if Zanardi had to wait that long after his life-threatening crash? The thought is chilling.

Or just imagine if he was on fire...just as Derek Daly and Bob Varsha alluded to, this was quite pathetic.

Dr. Corkski

06-21-04, 04:18 AM

F1 really dropped the ball on this one, but unlike NASCAR this was more of an abberation than the norm.

BTW, did anyone else notice how Webber kept on wanting to run into Ralf's damaged car? I am sure if the Jag was painted red there wouldn't have been a lynch mob to hang him already. :thumdown:

Insomniac

06-21-04, 08:35 AM

Is this a consequence of not going FCY? Not this accident per se, but the assumption that the driver is okay and to wait to go out there. In ChampCar, the assumption is the driver may be hurt and they're rolling.

Another thing that I thought was (I don't think anyone noticed) that Ralf's visor was forced open on impact. In ChampCar, they ask the drivers to open their visor's if they are okay. Maybe they do the same thing in F1 and thought he was okay at first and waiting for the cars to go by before hopping out?

RTKar

06-21-04, 08:38 AM

Since that point of the circuit has the most potential for a serious hit, there should be a dedeicated safety team standing by just for that segment. since hind sight is 20/20..might as well extend the safer barrier too.

indyfan31

06-21-04, 09:22 AM

BTW, did anyone else notice how Webber kept on wanting to run into Ralf's damaged car? I am sure if the Jag was painted red there wouldn't have been a lynch mob to hang him already. :thumdown:

Well, I read this 5 times and still can't make any sense of it. What are you trying to say?

TedN

06-21-04, 12:23 PM

Another thing that I thought was (I don't think anyone noticed) that Ralf's visor was forced open on impact. In ChampCar, they ask the drivers to open their visor's if they are okay. Maybe they do the same thing in F1 and thought he was okay at first and waiting for the cars to go by before hopping out?

This shot (http://www.itv-f1.com/ImageLibrary/30415_2.jpg) seems to confirm that his visor opened on impact.

Ted

Railbird

06-21-04, 01:34 PM

why would it be anyone but Gene?

why would the presence of a competent test driver discourage the unemployed from ringing them up?

Insomniac

06-21-04, 02:52 PM

Well, I read this 5 times and still can't make any sense of it. What are you trying to say?

I think he was talking about all the yellow laps. Webber kept going straight at the wreck while everyone else was going to the left to avoid it much earlier. The best example was when Montoya passed him and waved at him with that "WTF are you doing?" wave.

Insomniac

06-21-04, 02:54 PM

This shot (http://www.itv-f1.com/ImageLibrary/30415_2.jpg) seems to confirm that his visor opened on impact.

Ted

Yup, that's what I saw from the TV replays. I knew there was no way he put the visor up himself while he was spinning around. That also seems to show he missed the SAFER barrier by more than the 10ft DD estimated during the race. What caused that? Suspension failure? Or tire failure like Alonso?

Andrew Longman

06-21-04, 03:33 PM

[QUOTE=Dr. Corkski]F1 really dropped the ball on this one, but unlike NASCAR this was more of an abberation than the norm.

Maybe.

I've long noticed that in F1 the driver most often is out of the car on his own before the safety crew is on scene. Just yesterday think of Alonso out looking at his deflated tire while the safefy guys are still in route.

When the driver is not hurt that is fine. But sometimes he doesn't know he's hurt. In Champ car and I believe the IRL the drivers are told to sit tight until the crew is there to help, even if the is no hint of an injury.

Joe in LA

06-21-04, 04:07 PM

There is really no question that F1 needs to rethink its medical car set up. The idea that a wreck in front of the pits would require the responders to do a lap in a street car to get there is nuts. That builds in at least a three minute delay.

As to Webber--I don't know what he was thinking, Montoya nearly had to stop to let him get back in line. All Mark did by following that path was risk his tires, Ralf and the safety guys health and the drivers' behind him's cooling systems(mental and mechanical). Still don't know why they didn't route them all through pitlane.

TedN

06-24-04, 07:18 PM

I've been told his bell was well and truly rung.

Past performance considered, there may be a seat available at Silverstone.

Here (http://www.google.ca/search?q=cache:fnMN161_XSAJ:espn.go.com/rpm/2003/0430/1547234.html+concussion+%2B+olvey&hl=en) is a really good article on a system called ImPACT used in Champ Car and IRL to determine a driver's readiness to return after a concussion.

Wonder if F1 uses it or something like it?

Also big kudos to Dr Olvey!

Ted