View Full Version : Dale Coyne will run 2 cars
More good news!
http://www.cart.com/News/Article.asp?ID=7585
Thanks for your years of support, Dale. Great to see you continue in the series. :thumbup:
racer2c
03-19-04, 10:13 PM
:thumbup:
Come on LB!
I'm guessing one of them Michael Keohane from Ireland, who I hear is pretty talented...and also fairly personable...which should be good for media. He'd come with sponsors too!
Now who's the other?
Hard Driver
03-20-04, 01:14 AM
:thumbup:
Railbird
03-20-04, 09:46 AM
Not only does this help the car count situation, with Firman and Keohane we've got a couple fairly interesting additions to the field.
Good news
Insomniac
03-20-04, 09:46 AM
Woohoo! 13 + Jourdain!
Geoff Boss again?
I think we might see Thomas Biagi in a champcar real soon....maybe, a coyne?
Racing Truth
03-21-04, 12:57 PM
Not only does this help the car count situation, with Firman and Keohane we've got a couple fairly interesting additions to the field.
Good news
This is an excellent point. Now we get to see if Coyne can run a decent operation now that driver talent can't be an excuse. I do think they'll do better. How much so? I don't know, but this is still Dale Coyne we're talking about.
TravelGal
03-21-04, 01:23 PM
This is an excellent point. Now we get to see if Coyne can run a decent operation now that driver talent can't be an excuse. I do think they'll do better. How much so? I don't know, but this is still Dale Coyne we're talking about.
Thank you RT. Joel Camathias, one of the last year Coyne ride buyers, lost his seat when the money ran out, managed to refund himself, and realized that he'd just be tossing the money away because certain quality guarantees could not be met. Those cars are yellow for a reason, IMHO.
===> sure hope I'm wrong on this but, we'll see. Either I'll be spectacularly wrong (hope so), or the faithful will turn on Coyne (again) when those cars start dropping their various parts thither and yon around the course.
Either way, at least it's a chance for whatever drivers he picks (just ask Paul Tracy) and it sure helps the series when we need it. So, I'll clam up about it. (But thanks for posting RT! ;-)
Insomniac
03-21-04, 08:09 PM
Thank you RT. Joel Camathias, one of the last year Coyne ride buyers, lost his seat when the money ran out, managed to refund himself, and realized that he'd just be tossing the money away because certain quality guarantees could not be met. Those cars are yellow for a reason, IMHO.
===> sure hope I'm wrong on this but, we'll see. Either I'll be spectacularly wrong (hope so), or the faithful will turn on Coyne (again) when those cars start dropping their various parts thither and yon around the course.
Either way, at least it's a chance for whatever drivers he picks (just ask Paul Tracy) and it sure helps the series when we need it. So, I'll clam up about it. (But thanks for posting RT! ;-)
I had no problem with his cars being rolling chicanes. It was quite entertaining when both cars were out on hte warm up lap last year. Poor guy. Things can only get better. :) I'll turn on him when he turns on us. ;)
TravelGal
03-21-04, 09:29 PM
I had no problem with his cars being rolling chicanes. It was quite entertaining when both cars were out on hte warm up lap last year. Poor guy. Things can only get better. :) I'll turn on him when he turns on us. ;)
Insomniac, that's awful!!!! :rofl: Can't help laughing though. Better to laugh than to cry. I was sure glad Joel was out of those banana boats by that time.
And the drivers are:
Patrick Carpantier
Michel Jourdain Jr.
nz_climber
03-21-04, 09:48 PM
And the drivers are:
Patrick Carpantier
Michel Jourdain Jr.
i sure hope your joking :confused:
i sure hope your joking :confused:
Me too.
What happened to Coyne anyway? He has always run a rent-a-ride operation, but it wasn't so long ago that his team at least seemed capable of screwing a car together well enough that drivers like Barron and Gidley were able to show some promise and score top tens.
Jervis Tetch 1
03-21-04, 11:06 PM
"to be announced soon..."
My question is when is soon?
I wonder who we will see in what rental-cars at Long Beach? I wonder if guys like Andrea Montermini, Frank Freon or Eliseo Salazar can get some sponsorship money together and venture back into a Champcar. Friday AM at Long Beach will be fun, I'm sure that is when we will really know whos driving what Coyne or Conquest at Long Beach.
Wolverine
03-22-04, 10:13 AM
Thanks for your years of support, Dale.
Please. Dale Coyne has never put anything into Champ Car or its previous incarnations. He has always been strictly a buy-a-ride vendor who races only when someone brings him enough money. When the buy-a-ride dollars dry up, it's always been goodby Coyne until the next buyer shows up. Kirk Russell and Wally Dallenbach made Mr. Coyne a very wealthy man over the years by allowing his drivers to start races when they really had no business doing so, which led to Coyne getting franchise membership in the old CART and making a killing when CART went public.
It's great to have a couple of more cars to help Champ Car fill the grid, but let's not get too teary-eyed about Mr. Coyne's "contributions" over the years.
Mr. Coyne has never accepted money to run both leagues such as the likes of Walker, Mo Nunn, Fernandez, Rahal, Patrick and the list grows longer.
Mr. Coyne may require sponsorship dollars from the driver yet, he has never entertained a drive interested in the IRL. He has remained a one series owner and that is much better than some of the traitorous yenwhores that have surfaced as of late.
For those reasons, he is a valued team owner that has shown that he would rather not run than run in the IRL.
Thank you Mr. 7. It's amazing how good news threads turn negative around here. Reminds me of a prior forum I once belonged to. :shakehead
I posted this in the "biggest CART Supporter" thread, but I'll post it again here:
Coyne was the Interim CEO who didn't run the series into the ground.
Coyne rides did a lot for to boost the careers of to Tracy, Moreno, Barron, Manning, and others.
Coyne was the first owner to hire Memo Gidley as a full time driver.
Coyne didn't leave drivers, crew members, suppliers, high and dry waiting for checks that never came.
Coyne didn't leave CART for easy pickings in the IRL like fellow backmarkers Menard, Foyt and Hemelgarn.
Jervis Tetch 1
03-22-04, 11:47 AM
Hey, Wolverine's post brought up some good points.
I'm sure if the I*L came-a-calling with yen for Dale, he'd go there too. He's a mercenary with the best of them.
Hey, Wolverine's post brought up some good points.
I'm sure if the I*L came-a-calling with yen for Dale, he'd go there too. He's a mercenary with the best of them.
You'll note that I have lost all respect for those involved in open wheel these days, but let's not condemn Coyne, or anyone else, on the assumption that he is going to sin.
pfc_m_drake
03-22-04, 11:55 AM
Please. Dale Coyne has never put anything into Champ Car or its previous incarnations. He has always been strictly a buy-a-ride vendor who races only when someone brings him enough money. When the buy-a-ride dollars dry up, it's always been goodby Coyne until the next buyer shows up. Kirk Russell and Wally Dallenbach made Mr. Coyne a very wealthy man over the years by allowing his drivers to start races when they really had no business doing so, which led to Coyne getting franchise membership in the old CART and making a killing when CART went public.
It's great to have a couple of more cars to help Champ Car fill the grid, but let's not get too teary-eyed about Mr. Coyne's "contributions" over the years.
You're confusing Dale Coyne with Gerald Davis.
Seriously though - read JoeBob's post about Coyne. I understand what you're saying, and I'm certainly not proclaiming Dale as some sort of god, but he has done some good things over the years.
lone_groover
03-22-04, 12:04 PM
...or Joy Ryder and Avis Davis.
:)
Insomniac
03-22-04, 03:35 PM
Insomniac, that's awful!!!! :rofl: Can't help laughing though. Better to laugh than to cry. I was sure glad Joel was out of those banana boats by that time.
Even crazier is that is probably the most air time Dale Coyne got all year. I have to give it to him though. Even though his guys were ride buyers last year, he had a 2 car team all year however uncompetitive. Hopefully this year the teammates can work better together and they'll field some better Lolas.
Insomniac
03-22-04, 03:35 PM
"to be announced soon..."
My question is when is soon?
Before Long Beach. ;)
Jervis Tetch 1
03-23-04, 11:36 AM
You're confusing Dale Coyne with Gerald Davis.
Seriously though - read JoeBob's post about Coyne. I understand what you're saying, and I'm certainly not proclaiming Dale as some sort of god, but he has done some good things over the years.
And you're confusing fact with fiction.
I worked with Gerald Davis for four years, two with Pennzoil-Hall and both of Gerald's seasons as a car owner.
With no respect intended for Dale, Gerald's operation was far better and the proof was according to two former members of Dale's crew who worked with us.
In addition, after Gerald's deal with Arnd Meier ended, he was approached by two paying drivers, one of them Luiz Garcia Jr. into running the team. Gerald thought about it, but decided against running a pay-per-race team. He was ALSO approached about running in the I*L, but Gerald wanted nothing to do with that.
I certainly don't pretend to speak for Gerald, and I'm not, but I am stating what happened.
Gerald deserves better than that.
Davis gets stuck with that label because he took over the team's long enough to get the franchise and the stock that went with it - which he sold the day he was able to. Davis made a lot of money in that deal, and only ran his team for a year.
Jervis Tetch 1
03-24-04, 09:58 AM
Davis gets stuck with that label because he took over the team's long enough to get the franchise and the stock that went with it - which he sold the day he was able to. Davis made a lot of money in that deal, and only ran his team for a year.
Why begrudge Gerald because he made some money? At least he didn't take it to the I*L nor did he sell himself out. You need to do your research. Gerald ran his team TWO years (97-98). As I stated before I was on his team both years.
If you don't believe me, check out the books. He ran Gualter Salles in 1997 and Arnd Meier in '98. It's a fact.
pfc_m_drake
03-24-04, 11:15 AM
Well, I guess the point is this:
As in JoeBob's original post Coyne has run Tracy, Moreno, and others over the years. He was in for 2 cars last year. Rumors are that he'll be in for two cars this year. Coyne paid his bills and took care of crew members. Somebody then ragged on Coyne for his contributions, and I compared him with Davis.
Also consider that Coyne was in CART last year and likely will be in OWRS this year. In contrast, by your own admission, rather than continuing his team with a driver bringing sponsorship (Garcia Jr. - Hollywood) and continuing his relationship with a supplier (Lola), Davis elected to cash out straight away and close up shop. Hence, the difference between Davis and Coyne.
Do I begrudge Davis for checking out and making money? No, it's the American way. However, I think you're going to have a hard time framing him as a great CART loyalist under those circumstances.
You're right, he ran the team for two years, not one. I can't blame Davis for what he did, he took more from CART than he gave.
Here's the list of who got CART IPO stock, and how much they got:
All American Racers, Inc: 466,666 shares
Arciero-Wells Racing, Inc: 360,000 shares
Arciero-Wells Racing II, Ltd., LLC: 66,666 shares
Bettenhausen Motorsports, Inc: 400,000 shares
Dale Coyne Racing: 720,000 shares
Davis Racing, Inc: 400,000 shares
Della Penna Motorsports, Inc: 400,000 shares
Forsythe Racing, Inc: 400,000 shares
Hogan Racing, L.L.C.: 400,000 shares
Newman/Haas Racing: 800,000 shares
PacWest Racing Group: 800,000 shares
Patrick Racing, Inc.: 800,000 shares
Penske Racing, Inc.: 800,000 shares
Project Indy: 66,666 shares
Chip Ganassi Racing Teams, Inc.: 800,000 shares
Tasman Motorsports Group: 800,000 shares
Team Green, Inc: 400,000 shares
Team Rahal, Inc.: 800,000 shares
Walker & Associates Motorsport, Ltd.: 400,000 shares
Of the team owners who got rich off of the CART IPO, Gerald Davis is the one who contributed the least to the series. He picked up the pieces of Jim Hall's team just long enough to get rich, and then moved on.
I can't fault the guy, he didn't strike me as a rich guy out to play with some expensive toys (like say, Ganassi, Penske, Patrick, and others). He was a team manager who worked his way up and eventually got enough credibility and money to run a team. Derrick Walker, Barry Green and Mo Nunn did the same - and I have a lot of respect for them because they were able to do it.
Davis barely got his feet wet before cashing in and moving on. That is well within his rights to do - I can't say I wouldn't do the same thing. But, when you do something like that, you can't expect history to view you kindly.
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