View Full Version : Here is somethng we can argue about
Napoleon
05-23-16, 01:41 PM
I just scanned through this (I will give it a detailed read tonight), but like things such as list of Top-10 movies of all times and things of that sort, this could be interesting to see what you all think.
Which rock star will historians of the future remember? (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/29/magazine/which-rock-star-will-historians-of-the-future-remember.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=photo-spot-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news)
It may be a few days before I give my thoughts, but as close as I have come to thinking about this subject is regarding our local institution the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, which I have always thought that if they put one statue out front that it should be of Chuck Berry, but I guess that is an answer to the question "Which Rock Star should historians remember.
PS, so I proof read the post but not the stupid caption. God am I dumb!
Easy...Bieber. :gomer: :saywhat: :irked:
WickerBill
05-23-16, 02:45 PM
I would think it'll be one of those that (seemed to) change the face of music.
Elvis
Buddy Holly
Beatles
Michael Jackson
Nirvana / Pearl Jam
But it very well could end up being the exact opposite - a very popular act that epitomized the era. In that case, Led Zeppelin, Madonna, Coldplay. *shudder*
I would think it'll be one of those that (seemed to) change the face of music.
Elvis
Buddy Holly
Beatles
Michael Jackson
Nirvana / Pearl Jam
But it very well could end up being the exact opposite - a very popular act that epitomized the era. In that case, Led Zeppelin, Madonna, Coldplay. *shudder*
WB, you forgot KISS. ;)
#5...Nirvana was too short-lived, but did start the grunge revolution. But Dave Grohl did continue on, and does about everything you can imagine.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98yQiEtSshs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2w0JiLKQ3-o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yB9RgYcte_A
:)
so essential, this...
3Z2vU8M6CYI
Napoleon
05-23-16, 05:23 PM
Too Funny - in reading the comments to the NY Times piece, which, and I didn't realize this when I posted this, picks Chuck Berry, someone mentioned this which I recall. From SNL, Apr 22, 1978, a skit with the following name and people and this dialog:
Next Week in Review
Maxine Universe.....Laraine Newman
Mitzi Molnar.....Jane Curtin
Cocuwa.....Steve Martin
Kreeg Antwoord.....Dan Aykroyd
Kreeg Antwoord: [ coughing ] You see, it all started on August 20th, 1977, when NASA put up a recording of the sounds of Earth on Voyager I. A two-hour long tape included, uh, natural sounds of animals, a French poem by Gaugliere, a passage from the Koran in Arabic, messages from President Carter, United Nations Secretary Kurt Waldheim, music -- everything from classical to Chuck Berry.
Maxine Universe: Uh -- and you're saying that the, uh -- another civilization has found the tape?
Cocuwa: Yes. They've sent us a message that actually proves it. It may be just four simple words, but it is the FIRST positive proof that other intelligent beings inhabit the universe.
Maxine Universe: Uh -- what are the four words, Cocuwa?
Cocuwa: The four words that came to us from outer space -- the FOUR words that will appear on the cover of Time Magazine next week -- are: [ he holds up the magazine" "Send More Chuck Berry".
http://snltranscripts.jt.org/77/77rreview.phtml
Don Quixote
05-23-16, 06:32 PM
Not really Rock and Roll, but in my mind it all started with Robert Johnson.
I would also add Bob Dillon to the list.
I would also add Bob Dillon to the list.
Not familiar...but I have heard some Bob Dylan tunes, tho.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGEIMCWob3U
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJpB_AEZf6U
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSsMH4s7BeA
But then again, I don't have access to what's blowin' in yer wind. :gomer:
datachicane
05-23-16, 07:25 PM
My wife and I had our daughter late in life, so I'm an old guy with a teenaged kid. Volunteering with her school's band program and talking with her friends when they hang out around the house, I'm continually amazed by their taste in music. The Beatles, Hendrix, The Who, Pink Floyd, stuff that's 40 and 50 years old now- who'da thunk? Very strange talking to 16-17 yr old kids who know all about Moon's Pictures of Lily set and Stu Sutcliffe, but have a hard time identifying a Radiohead track. :confused:
I don't know if it's bleedover from relentless marketing and media pandering to boomers, if they're atypical being mostly musicians, or something else, but it's mighty strange.
It's not rock, and I generally don't do country, but when I do, It's Willie...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kn-AB78kvvE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8A9Y1Dq_cQ
:D :thumbup:
Napoleon
05-23-16, 07:43 PM
Now I have completely read that piece and it is really interesting, even if I disagree with parts of it. For those that have not, he runs trough these possibilities, Beatles, Dylan, Elvis, Stones before settling on Berry.
BTW People, this is who "will" be the single artist most associated, not who "should".
I completely agree with his reasons for Berry, at least as to who "should" be that person. It perfectly matches what I think,but much better said. As to who it will be, its hard to think it will not be the Beatles for one reason, 200 years from now its hard not to believe that a significant portion of the population in the west will not know some of there songs.
Steve, that video is hilarious. I say that as someone with a history degree.
Data, its not usual to see kids with T-shirts for bands like the Who, Pink Floyd or the Beatles. By the way, there are plenty of great bands out there. I now think music has never been better, so learn some of the new bands.
And what I consider an underrated super group of their time...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AWdrtR8qXYs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egJR3K6UIJY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IeDMnyQzS88
Gabriel, Collins, Rutherford, Banks...Lamb Lies Down and A Trick of the Tail are among my fave albums.
WickerBill
05-23-16, 08:20 PM
I think, to troll the future, we should bury a music time capsule, and when they open it in 100 years, it's just completely full of memorabilia and CDs of The Hooters.
I think, to troll the future, we should bury a music time capsule, and when they open it in 100 years, it's just completely full of memorabilia and CDs of The Hooters.
Hey - what is wrong with the Hooters? Heard quite often on the Philly rock stations! :rofl:;):D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LE0KpcP05I
cameraman
05-23-16, 11:29 PM
Well if you're gonna post up the Hooters you really should put up this one, I clearly remember this one.
zB1Q-PfUvN0
I think, to troll the future, we should bury a music time capsule, and when they open it in 100 years, it's just completely full of memorabilia and CDs of The Hooters.
We should just Rick Roll 'em.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
nrc, play nice...WB is still verklempt from the Go Gos reunion appearance Sunday night at the Billboards. :tony: :D
I was contemplating this today before I could read the story and most of my point was going to be pretty much what the story is about. How much space the Berry, Elvis, The Beatles, or whoever get probably depends on what direction music goes in the future. What facet of rock (or any other genre) will be seen as relevant to whatever those kids tomorrow are listening to? That's what will probably determine the names that are cited to represent music from our era.
The trend today seems to be that music is becoming a low value commodity media. "These kids today" on the whole seem less and less willing to pay for music. While one can cite a wealth of counter-examples, the overall trend is that fewer and fewer artists are able to make a living making music. The iGooglocracy seems intent on removing as much of the cost from their music revenue as possible. I can't begin to predict how this will affect tomorrow's music.
"Gee, great, great, Grandpa Brain-in-a-jar, you used to pay people to make music? That must have been before everyone had an iSwift to automatically generate the optimal music and lyrical patterns according to your current mood and social media."
nrc, play nice...WB is still verklempt from the Go Gos reunion appearance Sunday night at the Billboards. :tony: :D
Peh. WB is lucky to even get Internet in that backwater where he lives. He'll watch what we link for him and be glad. :gomer:
Napoleon
05-24-16, 06:01 AM
I have never heard of the Hooters.
Well if you're gonna post up the Hooters you really should put up this one, I clearly remember this one.
That is because you aren't from Philly. Zombies is the "we loved the Hooters before they hit it BIG" song. ;)
You probably don't remember Robert Hazard either - composer of "Girls Just Want to Have Fun" and the ever popular:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wIT2DpdcPzI
Side note - my school hired him to play a set at my prom in 1985. :D:rofl:
WickerBill
05-24-16, 08:53 AM
Peh. WB is lucky to even get Internet in that backwater where he lives. He'll watch what we link for him and be glad. :gomer:
YOU LIVE IN COLUMBUS
(but that does remind me, I have a great Comcast story... let me go find that thread)
YOU LIVE IN COLUMBUS
O-H! :D
(but that does remind me, I have a great Comcast story... let me go find that thread)
Comcast problems? That's unpossible! :gomer:
Peh. WB is lucky to even get Internet in that backwater where he lives. He'll watch what we link for him and be glad. :gomer:
You could at least share your WiFi with him. oHIo WiFi is FAR superior to Indy WiFi. :D
YOU LIVE IN COLUMBUS
(but that does remind me, I have a great Comcast story... let me go find that thread)
But we don't have to use duct tape for our Innerweb connections. :tony:
Oh, and I-O! :D
You do also realize that Cbus was one of the original cable franchises with an interactive cable service called QUBE.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QUBE
:)
datachicane
05-24-16, 11:53 AM
The trend today seems to be that music is becoming a low value commodity media. "These kids today" on the whole seem less and less willing to pay for music. While one can cite a wealth of counter-examples, the overall trend is that fewer and fewer artists are able to make a living making music. The iGooglocracy seems intent on removing as much of the cost from their music revenue as possible. I can't begin to predict how this will affect tomorrow's music.
I dunno- you're absolutely right that folks aren't shelling out $ to the record labels for multi-platinum records anymore, but that's only ever been a factor for a vanishingly small percentage of working musicians. Even in the slightly backwaterish burgh where I live, there's a healthy live music scene, and those same kids have no problems spending $$ to see those folks (and buy their home-produced recordings, for that matter). Even beyond the traditional live music venues, we've had an explosion of neighborhood house shows, 50-60 seats at a whack with 100% of the proceeds going to the band.
That same technology has makes a huge difference for these acts, allowing them to produce their own professional-quality recordings and effectively promote their own shows without waiting to be asked to dance by a label. I think the age of the big label and their near-complete control over every aspect of the industry, from which recordings were available to purchase to which artists were cultivated and marketed, was the anomaly enabled by the technology of the day, and in some ways another change in technology is allowing us to revert to the previous pattern.
Napoleon
05-24-16, 02:54 PM
I think, to troll the future, we should bury a music time capsule, and when they open it in 100 years, it's just completely full of memorabilia and CDs of The Hooters.
Two words: Spinal Tap
Two words: Spinal Tap
Because it goes to 11. :)
Requires video...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMSV4OteqBE
I dunno- you're absolutely right that folks aren't shelling out $ to the record labels for multi-platinum records anymore, but that's only ever been a factor for a vanishingly small percentage of working musicians.
Except not. The major labels still pull in the vast majority of the revenue for a shrinking pool of super-stars. 77% of the revenue goes to 1% of the artists. The rest take a sliver of the shrinking pie. Now streaming is consuming download revenues and independents are at a crippling disadvantage in trying to get fair compensation from technocrat grifters like YouTube, Pandora, and Spotify.
Even in the slightly backwaterish burgh where I live, there's a healthy live music scene, and those same kids have no problems spending $$ to see those folks (and buy their home-produced recordings, for that matter). Even beyond the traditional live music venues, we've had an explosion of neighborhood house shows, 50-60 seats at a whack with 100% of the proceeds going to the band.
It's great that they're living the dream. Nobody chasing the rock star dream wants to admit that they're working for pennies but eventually almost all of them will tire of busking for a living. The truth is that the number of working musicians has declined every year since 2001.
http://www.digitalmusicnews.com/2013/09/25/lies/
https://thetrichordist.com/2012/05/22/why-arent-more-musicians-working-professionally
cameraman
05-26-16, 02:42 AM
I've been to quite a few shows lately from bands that have made their fame on homemade Youtube videos followed up by Patreon campaigns and road warrior touring. Now they play sold out 3-700 seat venues on 50 show/3 month tours. They may not be multi-millionaires but they definitely are making a good living as even those shows are not inexpensive. They surely work for their money.
I've been to quite a few shows lately from bands that have made their fame on homemade Youtube videos followed up by Patreon campaigns and road warrior touring. Now they play sold out 3-700 seat venues on 50 show/3 month tours. They may not be multi-millionaires but they definitely are making a good living as even those shows are not inexpensive. They surely work for their money.
'tis why I follow WOTE. :)
datachicane
05-26-16, 04:36 PM
No argument that the big labels pulled in more $$ overall, but I do question whether the number of 'working' musicians has actually declined, and I'd definitely argue that many of those small acts are pulling in more money than ever now due to much of the same technology that's kneecapping the labels.
Good riddance, I say, if the bulk of the remaining pie goes to actual touring musicians rather than bloated label infrastructure and the .01% of artists they represent. And for that .01%? Not much sympathy from me if it's tougher for some entitled punk to make a living dragging his sorry a$$ into the studio once every 2-3-4 years. Criminy, look how many years the Dead were the top grossing act on the planet, while selling approximately zero albums, ever- they didn't do it by sitting in front of the TV. There's a reason why they (and acts of that ilk) encouraged tapers instead of trying to run them off.
No argument that the big labels pulled in more $$ overall, but I do question whether the number of 'working' musicians has actually declined, and I'd definitely argue that many of those small acts are pulling in more money than ever now due to much of the same technology that's kneecapping the labels.
Good riddance, I say, if the bulk of the remaining pie goes to actual touring musicians rather than bloated label infrastructure and the .01% of artists they represent. And for that .01%? Not much sympathy from me if it's tougher for some entitled punk to make a living dragging his sorry a$$ into the studio once every 2-3-4 years. Criminy, look how many years the Dead were the top grossing act on the planet, while selling approximately zero albums, ever- they didn't do it by sitting in front of the TV. There's a reason why they (and acts of that ilk) encouraged tapers instead of trying to run them off.
What's The Dead, hippie?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OekWK7LorMw
;)
Can't be a proper thread without...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-JQ1q-13Ek
:)
RaceGrrl
05-27-16, 03:22 PM
Except not. The major labels still pull in the vast majority of the revenue for a shrinking pool of super-stars. 77% of the revenue goes to 1% of the artists. The rest take a sliver of the shrinking pie. Now streaming is consuming download revenues and independents are at a crippling disadvantage in trying to get fair compensation from technocrat grifters like YouTube, Pandora, and Spotify.
It's great that they're living the dream. Nobody chasing the rock star dream wants to admit that they're working for pennies but eventually almost all of them will tire of busking for a living. The truth is that the number of working musicians has declined every year since 2001.
http://www.digitalmusicnews.com/2013/09/25/lies/
https://thetrichordist.com/2012/05/22/why-arent-more-musicians-working-professionally
Please cite your work in APA format. :tony:
Please cite your work in APA format. :tony:
http://i68.tinypic.com/2qk43kk.jpg
I have never heard of the Hooters.
If you are in Philly with nothing better to do ;)
http://i67.tinypic.com/104p1n7.png
The trend today seems to be that music is becoming a low value commodity media. "These kids today" on the whole seem less and less willing to pay for music. While one can cite a wealth of counter-examples, the overall trend is that fewer and fewer artists are able to make a living making music. The iGooglocracy seems intent on removing as much of the cost from their music revenue as possible. I can't begin to predict how this will affect tomorrow's music.
"Gee, great, great, Grandpa Brain-in-a-jar, you used to pay people to make music? That must have been before everyone had an iSwift to automatically generate the optimal music and lyrical patterns according to your current mood and social media."
I swear I hadn't heard of Googles efforts to " advance the state of machine-generated art" when I posted this.
http://www.theverge.com/2016/6/1/11829678/google-magenta-melody-art-generative-artificial-intelligence
Of course humans will still provide inputs for these art-generating neural networks...
http://36.media.tumblr.com/656db0a03b9f58ef984a953d5f88ca4b/tumblr_inline_o4buu90m241tgvpmu_1280.jpg
1980ish...I awoke from my Neil Diamond and parental units disco era. I started writing for my HS newspaper, so I started reviewing new music like Yes, etc. So I came across a review for So, which was dissed BIG time. Such good music (but needs John Cusack). :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evN6DIGPIJM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjEq-r2agqc
Back up vocalist in that first video is Paula Cole. Whatever happened to her? Did she find her cowboy?
Peter is on tour now with Sting.
Back up vocalist in that first video is Paula Cole. Whatever happened to her? Did she find her cowboy?
Peter is on tour now with Sting.
Sting with a beard.
Last I saw Paula was on tour with Melissa Etheridge mid 90s. It was...well, an interesting crowd to say the least. ;) And yes, I have her first CD in the collection. Interesting note on Etheridge...she did a concert here in Cbus at what was then known as the Newport, and the power went down. She finished the show acapella with her guitar.
cameraman
06-03-16, 10:55 PM
Back up vocalist in that first video is Paula Cole. Whatever happened to her? Did she find her cowboy?
Still out there. This was recorded a month ago.
k5K-NsTdVo8
Limited touring but if you liked the album "This Fire" twenty years ago, well this is your chance...
http://paulacole.com/tour
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baWVAESis0I
Chicks + acoustics == :)
1980ish...I awoke from my Neil Diamond and parental units disco era. I started writing for my HS newspaper, so I started reviewing new music like Yes, etc. So I came across a review for So, which was dissed BIG time. Such good music (but needs John Cusack). :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjEq-r2agqc
Yuge Kate Bush fans from the '80s. It was the crazy Kate Bush fans that helped us discover Tori Amos while she was still playing bars.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wp43OdtAAkM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDl3bdE3YQA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0XiuPkEq0Do
:)
Still my anthem...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pvfFuASYgfM
:)
Tori...yes she's in my collection, too. :-)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wVOpTTV5ds
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHkrM8WsSb0
But I have to give props to Alicia Keyes...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6PHOeXIPNZE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNpfUZI2w1M
;)
Tori...yes she's in my collection, too. :-)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHkrM8WsSb0
If the chord structure of the vocal break on "Hey Jupiter" sounds familiar it's because it was pretty much lifted from the "Purple Rain" cover that she performed on the previous tour. Love the song but that always bugged me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYS71ae2A9g
Sometimes imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. :)
stroker
06-05-16, 10:33 AM
The only professional musician I've ever known is Rocket Kirchner
https://www.youtube.com/results?q=Rocket+Kirchner
and I asked him this question about 25 years ago. He was of the opinion that Dylan would be the one who was most remembered. That surprised me as I wasn't (and never have been) much of a Dylan fan, as I'd figured it would be the Stones. I do like this one, though...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9EKqQWPjyo
Never was a big Dylan fan growing up (or Dillon per Donkey Boy :gomer: ), but have grown to respect him over the years. :thumbup:
And then there is this... :gomer:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OlLzAWUY6Xo
My belt buckle from the 80s...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4QK8RxCAwo
:D
My belt buckle from the 80s...
:D
I had one of those!
I had one of those!
I still do. :gomer: ;)
datachicane
06-05-16, 10:42 PM
Man, I'm old. Wonder what my wife would say if I broke my old belt buckle out?
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-jPsPSfT47UQ/V1TirmiSU6I/AAAAAAAAGTU/p_9BH9vmRWgavFyLxrvS2iztqHe3Wie8wCCo/s800/IMG_1160.JPG
Man, I'm old. Wonder what my wife would say if I broke my old belt buckle out?
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-jPsPSfT47UQ/V1TirmiSU6I/AAAAAAAAGTU/p_9BH9vmRWgavFyLxrvS2iztqHe3Wie8wCCo/s800/IMG_1160.JPG
I have that one somewhere around here too!
So now Starship Trooper is playing in my head.
There are worse things to be going on in there.... :gomer:
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