View Full Version : The Half Perfect Off Camber Story
Dirk Diggler
05-27-08, 01:54 PM
It's got a mass produced plane doing something odd and a racing connection. If only it had been a shipment of bacon and BBQ supplies...:\
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/may/25/plane.crash?gusrc=rss&feed=networkfront
http://image.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2008/05/25/plane460.jpg
cameraman
05-27-08, 01:59 PM
A miracle it did not catch on fire:eek:
http://aviation-safety.net/photos/accidents/20080525-0-C-d-3-500.jpg
Andrew Longman
05-27-08, 02:11 PM
Miracle it didn't go about another 100 ft. Obviously needed a drag chute :D
I saw this in the paper and didn't make the connection to Connie. Good for him he has a legit biz after drag racing. Not good for him his plane is toast. I hope he is insured well.
Sean Malone
05-27-08, 02:17 PM
I saw this on the front page of CNN.com the other day. Did they find out what the cargo was? It was unknown at the time.
Andrew Longman
05-27-08, 02:20 PM
I saw this on the front page of CNN.com the other day. Did they find out what the cargo was? It was unknown at the time.
I heard it was intestinal shrimp.
There, now the thread is perfect. :D
cameraman
05-27-08, 02:26 PM
One report said 76 tons of cargo but it did not say what type. The pilots heard two very loud bangs during the take off roll and they tried to abort. Well I suppose they did abort, it just wasn't too graceful.
Sean Malone
05-27-08, 02:40 PM
One report said 76 tons of cargo but it did not say what type. The pilots heard two very loud bangs during the take off roll and they tried to abort. Well I suppose they did abort, it just wasn't too graceful.
Imagine the look on the pilots faces when they walked out of their cabin!
It looks and sounded like it could have been much, much worse. I wonder what vector they were at? Past V1?
there's a couple of commercial pilots at my 'horns board, fwiw one said the guy he knows at kalitta says their maintenance record is anything but
cameraman
05-27-08, 04:02 PM
One of their 747's dropped its #2 engine into Lake Michigan a couple years ago...
nissan gtp
05-27-08, 04:59 PM
http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/stove_ownership.png
oddlycalm
05-27-08, 07:47 PM
the guy he knows at kalitta says their maintenance record is anything but Absolutely true, but that's only part of the long and sordid story... :D Kallita has been around a long time it's always been the same deal; ancient aircraft bought on the cheap (high landing cycles) with only enough maintenance to keep them in the air. I used to see his derelict DC8's with stencil and brush lettering at places like Roanoke and El Paso.
Connie folded the Kallitta Flying Service tent due to some pesky legal problems and re-invented himself as Kallitta Air in 2000. His current crop of 747's are 100 and 200 series from the early 1970's. They were dog tired before they came to him and he's landing them at many thousands of pounds over the gross landing weight they were designed for. The results are in Brussels for all to see.
This old litigation sheds some light to the recent incident. Assoc's, Inc. v Kallitta Flying Service (http://www.altlaw.org/v1/cases/440139)
Kallitta is flying his sleds way over certificated gross which is a recipe for disaster in a high landing cycle airframe unless a) the conversion was done properly, b) the pilots were trained to fly the modified aircraft and c) there are regular inspections of the structural elements. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess 0 for 3 on the above....:gomer:
oc
Spicoli
05-27-08, 08:14 PM
needs more :
http://pixpipeline.com/s/b83d7ace427f.jpg (http://pixpipeline.com/d/b83d7ace427f.jpg)
Dang. Slumlord of the skies. :gomer:
Good for the crew the failure happened close to the ground. :shakehead
Andrew Longman
05-28-08, 08:10 AM
So was the loud bang the fuselage coming apart (after too many cycles) or did the fuselage come apart as a result of the bumpy off runway excursion? Anyone care to guess?
chop456
05-28-08, 08:33 AM
One report said 76 tons of cargo but it did not say what type.
Probably a load of low-quality and especially heavy Airbus parts.
What is interesting is that this one wasn't one of their oldest.
Go to http://www.kalittaair.com/ and click on aircraft to see their fleet.
They've already removed the info on the one that went down (N704CK) but its info can be seen here: http://www.kalittaair.com/Aircraft/n705ck.htm
Probably a load of low-quality and especially heavy Airbus parts.
Another reason it's not the perfect story: Ank can't blame European subsidies .
grungex
05-28-08, 11:45 AM
uG-TCC0aV2g
So was the loud bang the fuselage coming apart (after too many cycles) or did the fuselage come apart as a result of the bumpy off runway excursion? Anyone care to guess?
Chuck Norris was told he was number two for takeoff. He immediately roundhouse kicked the preceding aircraft. Chuck Norris does not follow anyone.
more safety tips (http://www.x-plane.org/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t27135.html) for flying the Norris skies.
Another reason it's not the perfect story: Ank can't blame European subsidies .
I noticed you were absent come Super Bowl Sunday. I hope you told Roy "hi" for me at the Pro Bowl.
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/world/AP-Colombia-Plane-Crash.html?hp
another Kalitta 747 bites the dust
Andrew Longman
07-07-08, 07:24 PM
Holy crap. Kallita crew members are sure lucky. The plane in Belgium breaks up but has no fire. No one dies
And this they land a 747 in a pasture it comes apart, burns, but again no one dies.
They need more of that luck on their drag team. :(
cameraman
07-07-08, 07:38 PM
I'm not sure how lucky the two guys in the house that got steamrolled by a skidding 747 were...
oddlycalm
07-07-08, 08:09 PM
This isn't just bad luck, more like a pattern of behavior. Kalitta has a big facility at a former AFB in rural Michigan, where it is the largest employer in the county, to repaint the junk 747's it acquires. The paint is the only thing that's new though...
Here's the last liftoff for the one that cracked in half in Brussels.:shakehead
http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/middle/6/0/2/1369206.jpg
Methanolandbrats
07-07-08, 08:14 PM
If all the shoddy maintaince talk is true, why do pilots agree to fly them and why do regulators let them do business? That's kinda scary :eek:
Sean Malone
07-07-08, 08:28 PM
If all the shoddy maintaince talk is true, why do pilots agree to fly them and why do regulators let them do business? That's kinda scary :eek:
Pilots aren't the brightest batch of guys I've ever met. Remind me a lot of racecar drivers. :)
Andrew Longman
07-07-08, 09:04 PM
This isn't just bad luck...
True
But it is extraordinary luck that a Kallita employee hasn't been killed
Sad about the brothers on the ground. I didn't mean to imply otherwise, its just that living through ANY plane crash is remarkable.
Methanolandbrats
07-07-08, 09:29 PM
Pilots aren't the brightest batch of guys I've ever met. Remind me a lot of racecar drivers. :) That's a very disturbing thought considering commercial pilots have hundreds of lives in their hands. :saywhat:
Sean Malone
07-07-08, 09:45 PM
That's a very disturbing thought considering commercial pilots have hundreds of lives in their hands. :saywhat:
Ok, let me qualify that a bit...the 3 commercial pilots I know, 2 are freight haulers, one is a 'bus' driver. They are each focused, nerves of steel guys who know their jobs inside and out... just don't ask them to define the nuances between Kierkegaard and Nietzsche.
Methanolandbrats
07-07-08, 09:57 PM
Ok, let me qualify that a bit...the 3 commercial pilots I know, 2 are freight haulers, one is a 'bus' driver. They are each focused, nerves of steel guys who know their jobs inside and out... just don't ask them to define the nuances between Kierkegaard and Nietzsche.OK, that's cool....more like astronauts than race drivers. :thumbup:
no, astronauts are generally pretty ****ing smart.
ChampcarShark
07-08-08, 01:54 PM
no, astronauts are generally pretty ****ing smart.
Not really. It took them a lot of years to realize that tortillas are a form of bread.
Recently the space crew enjoyed tortillas (instead of bread) with peanut butter. (Per Danny Olivas, NASA astronaut). this so astronauts can have their bread and not have crumbs all over the place.
I have been eating tortillas with peanut butter since I was little, an I am not a teenager anymore.
http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewpr.html?pid=7412
says tortillas used since '85
Wheel-Nut
07-08-08, 02:16 PM
I have been eating tortillas with peanut butter since I was little, an I am not a teenager anymore.
But you live in Far Far Far West Texas and bread gets stale before it gets delivered out that way . . . . :p
If all the shoddy maintaince talk is true, why do pilots agree to fly them and why do regulators let them do business? That's kinda scary :eek:
I wonder if Boeing is getting tired of seeing their aircraft smashed into the ground by unresponsible owners?
ChampcarShark
07-08-08, 03:23 PM
http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewpr.html?pid=7412
says tortillas used since '85
Considering that the space race has been since the 1960s, that is a long time.
They did not mention that the tortillas are made by Taco Bell.
No wonder they taste like cardboard.
I was told in a recent visit to the space museum, in Alamogordo New Mexico, that they are flavored and improved now. As you know Danny Olivas is a native El Pasoan, so I quote him as my hometown hero.
Yes Wheel-Nut it is difficult to have fresh bread in here.
Considering that the space race has been since the 1960s, that is a long time.
back then everything was freeze-dried, cubed, tubed, etc.
cameraman
07-08-08, 03:43 PM
Did the mercury guys even have time to eat at all?
Glenn, on our side at least, was the first to eat up there.
Did the mercury guys even have time to eat at all?
I don't food was consumed in space until the Gemini missions.
-Kevin
Mercury had food, but again, highly packaged processed foodstuffs. Not really "food."
cameraman
07-08-08, 03:56 PM
The last Mercury mission was rather long and I'm sure Cooper ate.
The others, it is hard to say.
MR-3 - 15.5 minutes
MR-4 - 15.6 minutes
MA-6 - 4 hours 55 minutes
MA-7 - 4 hours 56 minutes
MA-8 - 9 hours 13 minutes
MA-9 - 34 hours 19 minutes
ChampcarShark
07-08-08, 05:14 PM
Mercury had food, but again, highly packaged processed foodstuffs. Not really "food."
It tastes funny. Has a good taste, but the texture is kind of yucky.
They sell samples of some foods at the museum.
I love the ice cream. It is like eating flavored chalk.
Gues it reminds me when I had to dust the erasers at school.
Methanolandbrats
07-08-08, 05:34 PM
I wonder if Boeing is getting tired of seeing their aircraft smashed into the ground by unresponsible owners? No, that means a new order on the books.
Mercury had food, but again, highly packaged processed foodstuffs. Not really "food."
I stand corrected. Tube 'food'. :yuck: :saywhat:
http://www.nasa.gov/audience/forstudents/postsecondary/features/F_Food_for_Space_Flight.html
-Kevin
oddlycalm
07-10-08, 04:12 AM
No, that means a new order on the books.
The day Kalitta steps up and buys a new plane will be the day I win my first F1 race...:laugh:
oc
The day Kalitta steps up and buys a new plane will be the day Danica wins her first F1 race...:laugh:
oc
The original post was too plausible, so I fixed it for you. :gomer:
@ the rate the airlines are retiring planes, Kalitta will have plenty of planes to choose from to replace these.
-Kevin
cameraman
07-10-08, 01:14 PM
@ the rate the airlines are retiring planes, Kalitta will have plenty of planes to choose from to replace these.
-Kevin
Not so much cargo aircraft. The cargo companies seem to hold on to their freighters forever. Fed Ex flies 727s out of Salt Lake every day. How fuel efficient can a 40 year old 727 be???
Turns out Fed Ex runs ninety Boeing 727-200s.
Not so much cargo aircraft. The cargo companies seem to hold on to their freighters forever. Fed Ex flies 727s out of Salt Lake every day. How fuel efficient can a 40 year old 727 be???
Turns out Fed Ex runs ninety Boeing 727-200s.
Passenger planes can be converted into cargo planes. Not sure about the co$t, but it's got to be less than a new plane.
-Kevin
Dirk Diggler
07-10-08, 01:47 PM
I wonder if Boeing is getting tired of seeing their aircraft smashed into the ground by unresponsible owners?
Probably, but there's not much they can do about what people do with used aircraft.
Along those lines, Cadillac probably wishes that people wouldn't turn their cars into lowriders with gold wire wheels and tiny tires after they've just spent tens of millions of dollars trying to convince people that they're just as upscale as Mercedes and BMW.:laugh:
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