I'm done.

[mapguy]

with USOWR.

Well, now that the fat lady has finished her performance I have taken an opportunity to sit back and collect my thoughts from the last week or so. Some people here seem to be excited by the fact that we are ‘all under one roof’ again. Most notably the ‘fence-sitters’ (and you know who you are. ;) ) and they seem to be almost blue in the face trying to tell the others that this is a good thing. Maybe it is, and for those who think that way, great. Good for you.

The biggest problem in all of this is that there never should have been a split in the first place. I will never forgive, nor forget, what that *****-lottery winning idiot did. The ‘success’ of the IRL over the years is good evidence that the CART board members were right in rejecting his original proposal. Lord Sagamore would eff up a lemonade stand on a 90 degree day. Now the idiot has what he wanted all along. To be the Boss of CART. But thanks to him there are a few differences. Major sponsors for one. Also Toyota, GM, Ford and Mercedes-Benz are gone. As are Reynard, Lola, Swift and Eagle.

Good Job Tony. The best thing about this is that there is no-one left to blame but himself when the ratings and sponsorship remain stagnant or drop.

The CART I fell in love with in the ‘80s is gone. I refuse to have anything to do with anything run by the inheritor. Even now there is a “IndyCar” race at the Glen only a two hour drive away. Nope. No can do. For me now it is historic racing, ALMS, SCCA and F1. Chalk up another lost fan.

Now I just look back at the memories and relive what an awesome series CART was.

• The Mansell/Tracy duel at New Hampshire in ’93. Probably the most intense bull-ring duel I have ever witnessed.
• The pass Greg Moore made on Zanardi at Rio.
• “The pass” at Laguna.
• PT coming from dead last to win at Road America with no FCR’s. Just ran every lap like it was qualifying.
• Juan Montoya, Jimmy Vasser, Alex Zanardi and the Target commercials.
• Jacques Villeneuve winning the last Indy 500 from two laps down.
• PT bursting onto the scene at Belle Isle in ’92 pushing Andretti the lessor around

There are many others but these are the ones that came to me this morning. Then there are the drivers that I witnessed that never would have been here if USAC was still in control.

• Emmo
• Nigel Mansell
• Alex Zanardi
• Jacques Villeneuve
• Juan Montoya

In closing I would just like to say Rest in Peace to the ones that we lost over the years. Greg Moore, Gonzalo Rodriguez, Railbird, fourrunner and others.

Drop the flag.

[Cam]

Dude! :cry: :amen:

[Lux Interior]

After knowing how great CART was, this is like getting the 2nd place prize on Jeopardy.

Our first place winner gets $167,000.

And to our runner up goes the 8 quart dutch oven and ginsu steak knive set by Ronco. Congats. :tony:

Thank you Tony George!:flame:

[Cam]

After knowing how great CART was, this is like getting the 2nd place prize on Jeopardy.

Our first place winner gets $167,000.

And to our runner up goes the 8 quart dutch oven and ginsu steak knive set by Ronco. Congats. :tony:

Thank you Tony George!:flame:

Christ! Are you still around?:tony:

[JT265]

You're gonna miss out on Gene Simmons autograph Davie. :yuck: Otherwise, great post. :thumbup:

[Napoleon]

:thumbup:

A perfect post on the subject.

Did you type it with or without your pants on?

[Spicoli]

Christ! Are you still around?:tony:

and you as well? :thumdown:

:gomer:

[murchman]

I too am done but I guess I have been for a couple of years now. FTG will never have me as a fan or even a follower.

[KLang]

Great post mapguy. :thumbup:

Matches my feelings exactly.

[anait]

After knowing how great CART was, this is like getting the 2nd place prize on Jeopardy.

Our first place winner gets $167,000.

And to our runner up goes the 8 quart dutch oven and ginsu steak knive set by Ronco. Congats. :tony:

Thank you Tony George!:flame:

That's just begging for a photoshop... :thumbup:

[Ziggy]

Mapguy

Thanks for being a part of it all. I have really enjoyed reading your takes. Some of those early days on SpeedNet were nothing short of hilarious. Through all these trials and tribulations who ever thought it would end like this?

Im also in the school that thinks that Tony George is incapable of running anything as complex as a bake sale, but will watch with keen awareness in knowing this is Openwheels last chance grasp

Best of Luck to you

Ziggy

[shomann]

So you and everyone else that says they are done are going to quit supporting your favorite driver or team because of the merger? Just drop them like a hot rock? Do you really care about any driver in the ALMS? Seriously.

I find it very hard to believe that anyone who truly cared about Champ Car won't be watching the first race and hoping their favorite driver wins it, and every other race.

[mapguy]

So you and everyone else that says they are done are going to quit supporting your favorite driver or team because of the merger?

Yes. Did you read my post? If you did then you'd know why.


Do you really care about any driver in the ALMS? Seriously.

Since when is it all about the drivers? This isn't NASCAR. CART had, at one point, 4 engine manufacturers, 4 chassis manufacturers and two tire companies. Now thanks to your hero, Mr George, we have two series with one chassis/engine combo apiece.

I started following racing back in 1982 following the original IMSA and the second Can-Am. I love pure-bred racing machines and right now ALMS is about it here in US Professional racing.


I find it very hard to believe that anyone who truly cared about Champ Car won't be watching the first race and hoping their favorite driver wins it, and every other race.

I find it hard to believe that anyone who truly cares about CART would be watching. Your hero, Tony George, started this mess and now we CART fans are just supposed to roll over? You and your TrackForum buddies would like that.

[Andrew Longman]

Sho:

Some folks are not fans of drivers and teams but rather just enjoy watching the accomplishment of performing at a high level and the competition itself.

I've watched racing for 41 years and while I've liked some drivers more than others, I've never watched to root for a driver. Ever.

Yes I'm curious to see how the CC teams will do and I will be happier if they win than if they don't, but overall I will not have huge interest. Curiousity yes, great interest no.

I have little interest because of the sport, as currently conducted has too little to do with teams and drivers performing at a high level and too few teams will even have a chance of winning. They can't even conduct a press conference at a high level. Indeed, they can't conduct a press conference or right a press release without embarrassing themselves.

[Ruben Barrios]

I understand mapguy... lately it's been about people you trust lying...

It feels like there is no reason to move forward...

However like I have stated before... This is like a divorce, just because you hate your ex, there is no reason to forget about the kids...

[nissan gtp]

I find the prospect of PT at Visions to be hy-sterical :laugh:

wouldn't miss it for anything

[Insomniac]

So you and everyone else that says they are done are going to quit supporting your favorite driver or team because of the merger? Just drop them like a hot rock? Do you really care about any driver in the ALMS? Seriously.

I find it very hard to believe that anyone who truly cared about Champ Car won't be watching the first race and hoping their favorite driver wins it, and every other race.

Why? CC is gone.

[shomann]

Why? CC is gone.

Yes, Champ Car is dead. What can we do about it? Nothing, other than to forge ahead.

Can you force yourself to become interested in ALMS? I can't. I don't care about anyone in the series, even though the cars are beautiful.

So to be a true Champ Car fan, should we now all hate the people we have cared about for years? Why wouldn't you continue to follow and support your favorite teams & drivers? Especially now that Champ Car is dead. It's all we have left.

Or didn't you care about the people involved?

[shomann]

Sho:

Some folks are not fans of drivers and teams but rather just enjoy watching the accomplishment of performing at a high level and the competition itself.

I've watched racing for 41 years and while I've liked some drivers more than others, I've never watched to root for a driver. Ever.

Yes I'm curious to see how the CC teams will do and I will be happier if they win than if they don't, but overall I will not have huge interest. Curiousity yes, great interest no.

I have little interest because of the sport, as currently conducted has too little to do with teams and drivers performing at a high level and too few teams will even have a chance of winning. They can't even conduct a press conference at a high level. Indeed, they can't conduct a press conference or right a press release without embarrassing themselves.

Andrew:

You've never rooted for a driver? How can that be? Isn't there someone you want to bond with and root for? One of my all time heroes is Alex Zanardi. Not the machine he almost died in.

Like it or not, this is what we're left with. I hate TG as much as anyone on this planet. If anything, that's what makes me even more passionate to root for the "ex" Champ Car teams and drivers. For me, it's good against evil.

[devilmaster]

I'll try and explain it once junior.

and i'll use small words and simple language.

Alot of the people here loved CART and early Champcar. Why?

Hard to drive cars, multiple engines putting out the most HP and sometimes blowing up (or often blowing up, as was toyo) to be the best.

A diverse mix of tracks meant that the champion proved he could drive them all, and the team could set it up for all.

Cheering on Champcar teams in the IRL doesn't mean squat because the true test of those drivers and teams is not there.

We loved racing. Not your wrestling bulls**t good guys against the bad guys.

Thats why the IRL has never appealed to us before, and does not now, regardless of who runs in it. Real racing. Real Sport.

If you want to truly understand - realize that most older fans here were fans of CanAm - in its heyday - it was an unlimited run what ya brung juggernaut. Not barn door wings and 650 hp with engines that run forever cause they're not being taxed.

I wouldn't care if McLaren or Williams or even Ferrari ran in the IRL. The IRL formula does not appeal to me - ergo I don't care about the teams that run in it.

[JT265]

I'll try and explain it once junior.

and i'll use small words and simple language.

Alot of the people here loved CART and early Champcar. Why?

Hard to drive cars, multiple engines putting out the most HP and sometimes blowing up (or often blowing up, as was toyo) to be the best.

A diverse mix of tracks meant that the champion proved he could drive them all, and the team could set it up for all.

Cheering on Champcar teams in the IRL doesn't mean squat because the true test of those drivers and teams is not there.

We loved racing. Not your wrestling bulls**t good guys against the bad guys.

Thats why the IRL has never appealed to us before, and does not now, regardless of who runs in it. Real racing. Real Sport.

If you want to truly understand - realize that most older fans here were fans of CanAm - in its heyday - it was an unlimited run what ya brung juggernaut. Not barn door wings and 650 hp with engines that run forever cause they're not being taxed.

I wouldn't care if McLaren or Williams or even Ferrari ran in the IRL. The IRL formula does not appeal to me - ergo I don't care about the teams that run in it.

I understood that clearly Steve, and you know I ain't that sharp. :D

[shomann]

I'll try and explain it once junior.

and i'll use small words and simple language.

Alot of the people here loved CART and early Champcar. Why?

Hard to drive cars, multiple engines putting out the most HP and sometimes blowing up (or often blowing up, as was toyo) to be the best.

A diverse mix of tracks meant that the champion proved he could drive them all, and the team could set it up for all.

Cheering on Champcar teams in the IRL doesn't mean squat because the true test of those drivers and teams is not there.

We loved racing. Not your wrestling bulls**t good guys against the bad guys.

Thats why the IRL has never appealed to us before, and does not now, regardless of who runs in it. Real racing. Real Sport.

If you want to truly understand - realize that most older fans here were fans of CanAm - in its heyday - it was an unlimited run what ya brung juggernaut. Not barn door wings and 650 hp with engines that run forever cause they're not being taxed.

I wouldn't care if McLaren or Williams or even Ferrari ran in the IRL. The IRL formula does not appeal to me - ergo I don't care about the teams that run in it.

OK buckwheat. I'll use small words and simple language too.

I've followed CanAm (where is it today?), CART (where is it today?) and Champ Car (where is it today?).

Unlimited run what ya brung hasn't worked out so well over the years has it? They are all dead!

I choose to continue to support the ex Champ Car teams and drivers because I love open wheel. And to me, people (aka humans) are more important than the machines. Comprende?

[Racing Truth]

I find the prospect of PT at Visions to be hy-sterical :laugh:

wouldn't miss it for anything

The only thing more hilarious than that would be PT in a Foytwagon (:gomer: rumor.). In fact, I'd pay good $ to hear the radio traffic with those 2.:rofl:

Anyway, I think it'll be Floyd or, yes, Vi$ion.:laugh:

[Andrew Longman]

You've never rooted for a driver?

For me, it's good against evil.

No I haven't. Alessandro is one of my heros too. It was remarkable to watch what he could do in a car and his approach to life is an inspiration.

But that doesn't mean I rooted for him to beat Greg Moore, Jimmy Vassar, Paul Tracy or any of the other drivers with the skill and nerve to strap on a Champ Car beast and competitively perform at their limits.

Watching PT and SB throw punches never interested me. Seeing neither back down on the track did and I cared little about who got taken out. Instead I cared to see how far either would push it.

Sorry. It was and never will be good vs evil for me. I admire them all as competitors.

The good vs. evil thing isn't real anyway. The good and evil are about equally self serving and the evil guys succeeded in forcing a crap spec and schedule on the entire lot.

[shomann]

No I haven't. Alessandro is one of my heros too. It was remarkable to watch what he could do in a car and his approach to life is an inspiration.

But that doesn't mean I rooted for him to beat Greg Moore, Jimmy Vassar, Paul Tracy or any of the other drivers with the skill and nerve to strap on a Champ Car beast and competitively perform at their limits.

Watching PT and SB throw punches never interested me. Seeing neither back down on the track did and I cared little about who got taken out. Instead I cared to see how far either would push it.

Sorry. It was and never will be good vs evil for me. I admire them all as competitors.

The good vs. evil thing isn't real anyway. The good and evil are about equally self serving and the evil guys succeeded in forcing a crap spec and schedule on the entire lot.

I agree with most things you say, but in the end it's people that risk their lives in the machines.

Yes, the Dallara's look and sound ugly. But that's what we've got until 2010. Hopefully, more mfg's will enter the fray then and it won't be a spec series anymore.

[G.]

I agree with most things you say, but in the end it's people that risk their lives in the machines.

Yes, the Dallara's look and sound ugly. But that's what we've got until 2010. Hopefully, more mfg's will enter the fray then and it won't be a spec series anymore.Is it possible for you to realize that there are some people on this board that just are NOT INTERESTED IN THE DAMN CARS and momentum racing bull**** no matter WHO the **** is driving them?

Is it possible for you to realize that there are some on this board that have been PERSONALLY affected (ie., employment) by the tantrum of FTG, and that their hate for what he did to the sport will not allow them to watch or follow?

Is it possible for you to realize that there are some on this board that have been so beaten down over the years by the lack of high-tech racing (like the CART era) that this final Absorption is the last straw?

On the other side, it IS possible for ME to realize that some folks will resign themselves to the sport hand that they are dealt, and will try to find enjoyment from watching the boy king's leeegue. For whatever their motives, desires, ambitions.

I believe that I just described a whole bunch of "real fans".

[nrc]

I choose to continue to support the ex Champ Car teams and drivers because I love open wheel. And to me, people (aka humans) are more important than the machines. Comprende?

That's fine. I don't see anyone here telling you what's right for you or what you should or will do. You don't seem to extend the same courtesy to others. Several times now you've picked fights over whether fans will or should follow the IRL. That stops now. If you're going to participate here you'll respect the choices of your fellow champ car fans.

For my part, I haven't had a true favorite team since Patrick racing and PPI left or a favorite driver since AlmondDinger. It's really quite absurd to demand loyalty to the teams and drivers when you consider the events of the past 12 years.

[eiregosod]

:tony: = Upper Class Twit

[Lux Interior]

So you and everyone else that says they are done are going to quit supporting your favorite driver or team because of the merger? Just drop them like a hot rock? Do you really care about any driver in the ALMS? Seriously.

I find it very hard to believe that anyone who truly cared about Champ Car won't be watching the first race and hoping their favorite driver wins it, and every other race.

Alan McNish is one of my favorite drivers and I always follow him.

[eiregosod]

Alan McNish is one of my favorite drivers and I always follow him.

McNish drove faster than Blundell for the Pac West drive in 1996, Blundell got the gig.

[TravelGal]

That's fine. I don't see anyone here telling you what's right for you or what you should or will do. You don't seem to extend the same courtesy to others. Several times now you've picked fights over whether fans will or should follow the IRL. That stops now. If you're going to participate here you'll respect the choices of your fellow champ car fans.



Thank you. For the first time ever I was about to ask if there were an ignore button on this website.

[DagoFast]

OK buckwheat. I'll use small words and simple language too.

I've followed CanAm (where is it today?), CART (where is it today?) and Champ Car (where is it today?).

Unlimited run what ya brung hasn't worked out so well over the years has it? They are all dead!

I choose to continue to support the ex Champ Car teams and drivers because I love open wheel. And to me, people (aka humans) are more important than the machines. Comprende?

I see the Hulman/George strategy of paying shills by the post in an effort to drag anyone they can to gomerpalooza is alive and well. :yuck:

[miatanut]

I'll try and explain it once junior.

and i'll use small words and simple language.

Alot of the people here loved CART and early Champcar. Why?

Hard to drive cars, multiple engines putting out the most HP and sometimes blowing up (or often blowing up, as was toyo) to be the best.

A diverse mix of tracks meant that the champion proved he could drive them all, and the team could set it up for all.

Cheering on Champcar teams in the IRL doesn't mean squat because the true test of those drivers and teams is not there.

We loved racing. Not your wrestling bulls**t good guys against the bad guys.

Thats why the IRL has never appealed to us before, and does not now, regardless of who runs in it. Real racing. Real Sport.

If you want to truly understand - realize that most older fans here were fans of CanAm - in its heyday - it was an unlimited run what ya brung juggernaut. Not barn door wings and 650 hp with engines that run forever cause they're not being taxed.

I wouldn't care if McLaren or Williams or even Ferrari ran in the IRL. The IRL formula does not appeal to me - ergo I don't care about the teams that run in it.

:thumbup:

[oddlycalm]

So you and everyone else that says they are done are going to quit supporting your favorite driver or team because of the merger? You make it sound like the EARL is gonna have Mark Donohue, Mario Andretti, Rick Mears, Alex Zanardi, Nigel Mansell and Dan Gurney with another dozen nearly as good. For those of us that grew up watching great drivers driving great cars on great tracks do you really think there is some aspect of this that is compelling? If there is, I'm not seeing it.

oc

[G.]

if this ****er does anymore "real fan of CC", "true Fan", "how can you not watch", BS, then nuke him. I don't want to hear that **** from ANYONE!

YMMV.

And yes, I'll prolly watch some.

Maybe.

Or not.



I will not tell YOU, and you sure as **** won't tell me, what to cheer for. I'll state my opinions, I'll make suggestions (MotoGP, ALMS), I'll embarrass myself all on my own.

We're being "gomered". slomo is playin.

[devilmaster]

OK buckwheat. I'll use small words and simple language too.

I've followed CanAm (where is it today?), CART (where is it today?) and Champ Car (where is it today?).

Unlimited run what ya brung hasn't worked out so well over the years has it? They are all dead!

So are a million other endeavours in this world. All of them died for different reasons, gomer. To say they all died because they were all unlimited specs is misleading and flat out wrong. Especially since CART and Champcar weren't unlimited the way CanAm was.


I choose to continue to support the ex Champ Car teams and drivers because I love open wheel. And to me, people (aka humans) are more important than the machines. Comprende?

Good for ya. As nrc has said, we here have respected your opinion that you will watch. I am not telling you not to support it. But don't come on here, making posts that you can't believe some of us won't follow the series.

And to be honest (and I actually gave it some thought), your post about rooting for the good vs. evil crap is, IMHO, the stupidest thing I have ever read on this board. The dumbest. Are the former drivers of CC going to do shoot promos now? talk about how they're going to take the others down at the next race? Pit crew members getting hit with chair shots just before the cars come in to pit?

So I again reiterate. If thats the reason everyone should watch, to root for the good guys against the bad guys, i'm happy and quite comfortable to not watch this s**t.

And finally, is this the best you got?

[Ziggy]

/\ Remember, Mike Hondretti has that short guido from Jersey to toss fat old men around /\ :rofl:

[devilmaster]

/\ Remember, Mike Hondretti has that short guido from Jersey to toss fat old men around /\ :rofl:

I can almost hear the IRL announcers now: 'He hit him with the Borg Warner trophy!!!! MY GOD!!!!! HE CAN'T DO THAT!!!! AND BARNHART WAS LOOKING THE OTHER WAY!!!! NO NO NO NO NO! THIS IS NOT FAIR, NOT FAIR!!!!!!'

[Hesketh]

with USOWR.

Well, now that the fat lady has finished her performance I have taken an opportunity to sit back and collect my thoughts from the last week or so. Some people here seem to be excited by the fact that we are ‘all under one roof’ again. Most notably the ‘fence-sitters’ (and you know who you are. ;) ) and they seem to be almost blue in the face trying to tell the others that this is a good thing. Maybe it is, and for those who think that way, great. Good for you.

The biggest problem in all of this is that there never should have been a split in the first place. I will never forgive, nor forget, what that *****-lottery winning idiot did. The ‘success’ of the IRL over the years is good evidence that the CART board members were right in rejecting his original proposal. Lord Sagamore would eff up a lemonade stand on a 90 degree day. Now the idiot has what he wanted all along. To be the Boss of CART. But thanks to him there are a few differences. Major sponsors for one. Also Toyota, GM, Ford and Mercedes-Benz are gone. As are Reynard, Lola, Swift and Eagle.

Good Job Tony. The best thing about this is that there is no-one left to blame but himself when the ratings and sponsorship remain stagnant or drop.

The CART I fell in love with in the ‘80s is gone. I refuse to have anything to do with anything run by the inheritor. Even now there is a “IndyCar” race at the Glen only a two hour drive away. Nope. No can do. For me now it is historic racing, ALMS, SCCA and F1. Chalk up another lost fan.

Now I just look back at the memories and relive what an awesome series CART was.

• The Mansell/Tracy duel at New Hampshire in ’93. Probably the most intense bull-ring duel I have ever witnessed.
• The pass Greg Moore made on Zanardi at Rio.
• “The pass” at Laguna.
• PT coming from dead last to win at Road America with no FCR’s. Just ran every lap like it was qualifying.
• Juan Montoya, Jimmy Vasser, Alex Zanardi and the Target commercials.
• Jacques Villeneuve winning the last Indy 500 from two laps down.
• PT bursting onto the scene at Belle Isle in ’92 pushing Andretti the lessor around

There are many others but these are the ones that came to me this morning. Then there are the drivers that I witnessed that never would have been here if USAC was still in control.

• Emmo
• Nigel Mansell
• Alex Zanardi
• Jacques Villeneuve
• Juan Montoya

In closing I would just like to say Rest in Peace to the ones that we lost over the years. Greg Moore, Gonzalo Rodriguez, Railbird, fourrunner and others.

Drop the flag.

There's enough hate there to post at Smack. :cool:

If you're done, then adios. The rest of us have some racing to do, and since this is the only open wheel game in town, that's the way it is. Good thing? It's the only thing. Both series were dying. Together, there's a chance that open wheel may survive. If you don't want to follow only because TG won, then see ya, mate. If you don't want to follow because of the package, I've got to ask you why you didn't walk away when Gerry and Kevin made Champ Car a spec series. If you don't want to watch because of the ovals, I've got to remind you of your love for CART.

There never should have been a split? Of course not. What's that got to do with where we are today? There never should have been a Civil War. But there was. Not everyone was pleased about the outcome, but the country came together and moved forward. So I guess you have a choice of moving forward with one unified series or, like Gerry, walking away in a huff.

I agree: drop the flag. We've got a lot of work to do if we're going to go racing.

[Andrew Longman]

/\ Remember, Mike Hondretti has that short guido from Jersey to toss fat old men around /\ :rofl:

Yo. He's not from Jersey. He's from Nazareth. The other side of the river.

[SteveH]

if this ****er does anymore "real fan of CC", "true Fan", "how can you not watch", BS, then nuke him. I don't want to hear that **** from ANYONE!

YMMV.

And yes, I'll prolly watch some.

Maybe.

Or not.



I will not tell YOU, and you sure as **** won't tell me, what to cheer for. I'll state my opinions, I'll make suggestions (MotoGP, ALMS), I'll embarrass myself all on my own.

We're being "gomered". slomo is playin.


:thumbup:

[Indy]

Good post, Hesketh.

Entire eras of racing in different disciplines have been more more like comedy than drama. What strikes me about all the comments lately on this site is that people are just taking this a bit too seriously as fans. After all, it is not your living on the line, so maybe you should relax and enjoy the ride. It will be good for a few laughs at the minimum.

Besides, as a wise man told me yesterday, do you really think that every fan eyeball is not going to be glued to the telecast from Homestead? :laugh:

[Insomniac]

Yes, Champ Car is dead. What can we do about it? Nothing, other than to forge ahead.

Can you force yourself to become interested in ALMS? I can't. I don't care about anyone in the series, even though the cars are beautiful.

So to be a true Champ Car fan, should we now all hate the people we have cared about for years? Why wouldn't you continue to follow and support your favorite teams & drivers? Especially now that Champ Car is dead. It's all we have left.

Or didn't you care about the people involved?

You said if people truly cared about Champ Car, not the drivers/teams. You simply do not understand that the IRL and Champ Car are not the same just because the teams are the same. The vast majoprity here did not start watching the IRL when Penske, TCGR, AGR, Rahal and Fernandez went to the IRL. So why would they when NHL and some others go?

[Insomniac]

Andrew:

You've never rooted for a driver? How can that be? Isn't there someone you want to bond with and root for? One of my all time heroes is Alex Zanardi. Not the machine he almost died in.

Like it or not, this is what we're left with. I hate TG as much as anyone on this planet. If anything, that's what makes me even more passionate to root for the "ex" Champ Car teams and drivers. For me, it's good against evil.

Who are the bad guys? Vision and Panther? Are Penske, AGR, TCGR and RLR good guys? They are CART guys. Why didn't you follow them to the IRL. You mean to tell me you were a Dale Coyne fan. Or Newman/Haas but not Michael Andretti? One of your heroes is Alex Zanardi but you don't care for TCGR?

[Insomniac]

Thank you. For the first time ever I was about to ask if there were an ignore button on this website.

There is. It took me a while to find it way back. I think someone had to tell me. View the user's profile and below the date/time the user last visited you can add them to your ignore list.

[Insomniac]

I can almost hear the IRL announcers now: 'He hit him with the Borg Warner trophy!!!! MY GOD!!!!! HE CAN'T DO THAT!!!! AND BARNHART WAS LOOKING THE OTHER WAY!!!! NO NO NO NO NO! THIS IS NOT FAIR, NOT FAIR!!!!!!'

The fix was in at the 2002 Indy 500. ;)

[Ray Scar]

Like it or not, this is what we're left with. I hate TG as much as anyone on this planet. If anything, that's what makes me even more passionate to root for the "ex" Champ Car teams and drivers. For me, it's good against evil.

You may be willing to buy some second rate product because it's the only one on the shelf but not me.

And if it's good against evil then what does your support say about you?

I wouldn't give one thin dime to TG. Not even if he could find a way to put Greg Moore himself in a car.

[RTKar]

So you and everyone else that says they are done are going to quit supporting your favorite driver or team because of the merger? Just drop them like a hot rock? Do you really care about any driver in the ALMS? Seriously.

I find it very hard to believe that anyone who truly cared about Champ Car won't be watching the first race and hoping their favorite driver wins it, and every other race.


I can't wait for the side by side action :rolleyes:

The last drivers I really liked were a young Mario in a white Dean Van Lines car, Jim McElreath and Lloyd Ruby. Drivers come and go, it's the general essence of the sport that kept me riveted, an evolution of technology throughout the years and a variety of venues, not contrived proximity "racing".

I've dropped sports and teams like a hot rock when I feel I'm being used by the league or the owner. This could be one of those instances...we'll see what happens.

ALMS is evolving, though not perfect, and the series seems to care about it's fans, with decent venues and technology to hold my interest.

[RaceGrrl]

Entire eras of racing in different disciplines have been more more like comedy than drama. What strikes me about all the comments lately on this site is that people are just taking this a bit too seriously as fans. After all, it is not your living on the line, so maybe you should relax and enjoy the ride. It will be good for a few laughs at the minimum.

Besides, as a wise man told me yesterday, do you really think that every fan eyeball is not going to be glued to the telecast from Homestead? :laugh:

This site is for Champ Car enthusiasts- not enthusiasts of the-series-which-shall-not-be-named-because-it-is-owned-by-an-idiot. We are fans of Champ Car racing. Why is that so fricking hard to understand?

It pisses me off that some of you keep telling me that I'll be watching.

Your "wise man" is not so wise. This household will not be watching.

[Andrew Longman]

ALMS is evolving, though not perfect,...

This seemed pretty perfect :D

http://youtube.com/watch?v=fbl_Yjm7VBk

[gerhard911]

Your "wise man" is not so wise. This household will not be watching.

Nor will mine :thumdown:

[Chiphead_Dave]

This household will not be watching.

Not mine either.

I don't watch pro football, pro baseball in spite of liking those games....I just can't stand the teams/players/fans of the pro level of those sports.
However I like watching it at the lower levels.

I won't watch NASCAB..... my IQ is too high.

ALMS is looking worthy of a viewing but at this point I am going to go flying more, running more......maybe I'll lose some weight.

[nrc]

Unfortunately I think what some people are seeing is that some champ car fans have frequently watched IRL racing "just to see how bad it is". Those fans will likely continue and some will eventually go to races "just to see how bad it is".

We've never been among them and won't start now. The changes required to make it something I'd be interested in watching are not so subtle that I need to tune in and watch for them.

[Grunschev]

I was looking for a "farewell" thread, but I'll post here.

I've enjoyed the sport since I first attended a race, the Denver GP back in 1989? 1990? I would watch it on TV if I happened across it, but I didn't become a fan until I caught the sights and sounds in person. I was a bit overwhelmed, I didn't know what to look for or at. And the smell... you'll never get that on TV. So I was hooked. And now it's done. It was fun while it lasted.

No, the "merged" series doesn't interest me. Frankly, the CCWS the last few years hasn't been the best product. I guess I knew it was going to end sometime, and perhaps end badly, but so it goes. Nothing lasts forever.

Despite my low number of posts, I've been reading this board regularly for ages. I guess it took me a while to find my way here after 7G. So I've been "listening" to some of you folks for a decade or so. You're almost like family. Crazy cousins you almost never see, but family nonetheless.

It's been a blast, and I'll miss it. But I'll remember most of it fondly. It's been exhilarating at times, it's been tragic at times. It's been real. I wish you all the best. Keep the shiny side up and the greasy side down. Keep all four tires on the ground, will ya?

Farewell.

Igor

PS. If I end up working in LA in April, I'll try to go to the last show.

[TravelGal]

There is. It took me a while to find it way back. I think someone had to tell me. View the user's profile and below the date/time the user last visited you can add them to your ignore list.

Thanks, Inso. I'll keep that in mind.

I completely forgot to direct a comment to Mapman in my first post in this thread. I'm really sorry to see you go guy. I always wanted to read what you had to say. I completely understand, however. And farewell also to Igor. You guys can always post in the other forums you know.....

Unlike some others who posted later, I can find some compassion in my heart for how hard this is for everyone who has to say goodbye. It's not something any of us wanted.

I have yet to make my decision about Long Beach. It depends on a lot of things that have yet to be said. But if I am not there to say goodbye, I am certainly not watching, that's for sure.

[SteveH]

I have yet to make my decision about Long Beach. It depends on a lot of things that have yet to be said. But if I am not there to say goodbye, I am certainly not watching, that's for sure.

I've made my decision. I'll be there on Sunday. Of course, my decision to attend was made in Dec. when I purchased airfare. But only in the past week have I decided to attend the race on Sunday. Will I watch any of the season? Depends. I used to plan my summer around the CART/ChampCar schedules and to some extent F1, also (but a DVR made that easier). Now, if I'm not doing much and if I catch it on the tube, I'll probably watch. Kind of like I did this afternoon with the Nationwide series race at Vegas. Flipped through the channels and there it was, so I watched. If the formula for ICS improves in the future, maybe I'll watch more. But there's no reason to think I should watch any more than I have in the past. There's no compelling reason to do so. Its the same as it always was. And that sucked.

[TravelGal]

If the formula for ICS improves in the future, maybe I'll watch more. But there's no reason to think I should watch any more than I have in the past. There's no compelling reason to do so. Its the same as it always was. And that sucked.

There you have it. Succinctly put SteveH. There are people on both sides and all areas in the middle and everyone is entitled to do as they please but from MY view, you've nailed it. Where's the llama when I need it?

[Kiwifan]

Whats a nice Gal like you doing with Llamas? ;) I've heard there are some naughty ones out there just waiting to catch you ladies out. :D

Back on topic, I think I'm done too and that really hurts because I loved her so.

Rusty.

[mapguy]

If you're done, then adios. I agree

We've got a lot of work to do if we're going to go racing.

I'm not leaving OffCamber. Just USOW. I've made too many friends here.

Good luck next year.

[mapguy]

Mapguy

Thanks for being a part of it all. I have really enjoyed reading your takes. Some of those early days on SpeedNet were nothing short of hilarious. Through all these trials and tribulations who ever thought it would end like this?

Im also in the school that thinks that Tony George is incapable of running anything as complex as a bake sale, but will watch with keen awareness in knowing this is Openwheels last chance grasp

Best of Luck to you

Ziggy

I just realized it. It's been 12 years since the SpeedNet forum wars. Damn. It seems that I have lost my 'edge' since then. Nice to see that you haven't...;)

I'ts been a great ride and I made a lot of friends along the way.

[nrc]

I'm not leaving OffCamber. Just USOW. I've made too many friends here.

Good luck next year.

Glad to hear it. :thumbup:

[Napoleon]

It's been 12 years since the SpeedNet forum wars. Damn.


Wow

[JT265]

Well, I'm as concerned a CCWS fan as any, :D but some numbnuts ain't gonna tell me to

COME WATCH THE EARL!!!! NOW WITH MORE SUCKAGE!!!!

CART II!!!! NOW WITH SH.........................................ITTY CARS!!!!!

Lawnmower racing holds more interest for me.

[RTKar]

This seemed pretty perfect :D

http://youtube.com/watch?v=fbl_Yjm7VBk

You mean people actually go to Sebring and watch the race? :p

[SurfaceUnits]

There's enough hate there to post at Smack. :cool:
If you're done, then adios. The rest of us have some racing to do,. the guy at the McDonalds window has more fans than irl.

[SurfaceUnits]

Good post, Hesketh.

Entire eras of racing in different disciplines have been more more like comedy than drama. What strikes me about all the comments lately on this site is that people are just taking this a bit too seriously as fans. After all, it is not your living on the line, so maybe you should relax and enjoy the ride. It will be good for a few laughs at the minimum.

Besides, as a wise man told me yesterday, do you really think that every fan eyeball is not going to be glued to the telecast from Homestead? :laugh:i'm sure both eye balls of the one remaining fan will be glued open, to avoid closing from the boredom amplified.

[Ankf00]

the .ca GP is 10x the experience any IRL race could hope to be, and now moto has 2 US events, so, sorry yo, the IRL is most certainly not the only game in town for me to attend in person and there are much better options on TV.

[Ray Scar]

I was looking for a "farewell" thread, but I'll post here.

I've enjoyed the sport since I first attended a race, the Denver GP back in 1989? 1990? I would watch it on TV if I happened across it, but I didn't become a fan until I caught the sights and sounds in person. I was a bit overwhelmed, I didn't know what to look for or at. And the smell... you'll never get that on TV. So I was hooked. And now it's done. It was fun while it lasted.

No, the "merged" series doesn't interest me. Frankly, the CCWS the last few years hasn't been the best product. I guess I knew it was going to end sometime, and perhaps end badly, but so it goes. Nothing lasts forever.

Despite my low number of posts, I've been reading this board regularly for ages. I guess it took me a while to find my way here after 7G. So I've been "listening" to some of you folks for a decade or so. You're almost like family. Crazy cousins you almost never see, but family nonetheless.

It's been a blast, and I'll miss it. But I'll remember most of it fondly. It's been exhilarating at times, it's been tragic at times. It's been real. I wish you all the best. Keep the shiny side up and the greasy side down. Keep all four tires on the ground, will ya?

Farewell.

Igor

PS. If I end up working in LA in April, I'll try to go to the last show.

:thumbup: Me too.

I've too have obviously lurked more than anything. But I have shared a few cool ones at Road America with some of you guys. Who could forget Nelsonmania? I still haven't forgiven myself for f&#$ing up the camera when Tag was signing it.

So who knows what the future brings? I have had time to post some lately due more to family matters rather than the remergicapitulation so this is a good time to say thanks also.

I'll be at RA for the ALMS/? weekend as usual so this isn't "I'm outta here", just a good time to take a breath.

Back to the circus.....

[nrc]

So who knows what the future brings? I have had time to post some lately due more to family matters rather than the remergicrapitulation so this is a good time to say thanks also.

Fixed it for you.

[Cam]

You are so malevolent Richard... ;) .

[mueber]

There is no one in American Open Wheel worth respecting. They've all lied to and betrayed the fans. In addition I haven't done business with Tony George for over a dozen years because Gomerville is the fundamental problem, and I'm not going to start now. If someone who is competent and ethical shows up and saves the sport, I'll be back. If not, F-1, ALMS, and MotoGP will continue to get my time and money, open wheel won't.

Those are my reasons and the resulting actions. If you have other reasons and actions, that's your business.

[Indy]

This site is for Champ Car enthusiasts- not enthusiasts of the-series-which-shall-not-be-named-because-it-is-owned-by-an-idiot. We are fans of Champ Car racing. Why is that so fricking hard to understand?

It pisses me off that some of you keep telling me that I'll be watching.

Your "wise man" is not so wise. This household will not be watching.

Sorry to raise your blood pressure. I ask you these questions in all seriousness.

We all agree on the idiot, but is it beyond possibility that champ car, the tradition, may not continue on as Indy Car, or does it necessarily die with CCWS, LLC? And, I thought crappiedom was about the negative more than the positive, but this place was more about the positive. Am I wrong? If so, then what will this forum be about?

Thanks, and I will not tell you who the wise man is. :D

[SurfaceUnits]

And, I thought the realists were about the negative more than the positive,fixed it for you

[nrc]

We all agree on the idiot, but is it beyond possibility that champ car, the tradition, may not continue on as Indy Car, or does it necessarily die with CCWS, LLC? And, I thought crappiedom was about the negative more than the positive, but this place was more about the positive. Am I wrong? If so, then what will this forum be about?

Is it beyond possibility that something worthy of Champ car tradition may rise out of the ashes? No. Is that reason enough to follow what Tony George will be offering this year and probably next? Not for me.

The notion that "I'm going to follow what's left" is positive and "I won't lower my expectations" is negative is faulty. They're both just opinions that people have for their own reasons.

This place is about champ car fans who want to talk about racing (and other stuff). There are other racing series that champ car fans can follow or some may take a break and follow none at all for a while. Maybe they'll keep visiting here and maybe they won't.

[Indy]

Specifically, is a person who was a CART/CCWS fan but who chooses to follow the "merged" series not considered a champ car fan in the eyes of this forum?

[cameraman]

Good Lord people, give it a rest. You guys are tap dancing in a mine field.

[Insomniac]

Specifically, is a person who was a CART/CCWS fan but who chooses to follow the "merged" series not considered a champ car fan in the eyes of this forum?

That should be obvious. People are only taking exception with people saying the opposite and telling people what to think. I don't think anyone here has told people not to watch or called them non-CC fans if they do. They have respected peoples decisions to watch if they want.

[manic mechanic]

I wuz gonna comment, but I'm not sure if I'm done yet...:laugh:

manic ;)

[Cam]

I wuz gonna comment, but I'm not sure if I'm done yet...:laugh:

manic ;)

I wuzzn't gonna comment but I am not sure if I really want to participate this....

Oh crap! :cry:

[Indy]

Good Lord people, give it a rest. You guys are tap dancing in a mine field.

Yeah, ok. I was curious because SOG or someone had gotten placed on moderation for stepping over the line, but I think that was before the mergerunifornication.

I suppose we shall see.

[Sean O'Gorman]

I was?

[Indy]

I was?

Sorry, I am not sure who it was.

[JLMannin]

Specifically, is a person who was a CART/CCWS fan but who chooses to follow the "merged" series not considered a champ car fan in the eyes of this forum?

No, but that is not the issue. The issue is Shoman telling me and others that if I do not watch the IRL now that the former CC teams are there, I am not a real fan.

If you want to watch the IRL, I will respect your choice to do so. All I ask in return is that you respect my decision not to watch the IRL.

[JLMannin]

Yeah, ok. I was curious because SOG or someone had gotten placed on moderation for stepping over the line, but I think that was before the mergerunifornication.

I suppose we shall see.

There may be just one, or there may be many more - however, only one made the decision to post their status - that was Jonovision.

[JT265]

I was?

Sadly no, but you should be. :p










:laugh:

[Andrew Longman]

Sadly no, but you should be. :p


:laugh:

I disagree. As perhaps the only person on this forum I've actually met (I met a few from 7G), and he didn't choose to attack me or my kids, sexually or otherwise, I give him my slack. :p

[Sean O'Gorman]

I disagree. As perhaps the only person on this forum I've actually met (I met a few from 7G), and he didn't choose to attack me or my kids, sexually or otherwise, I give him my slack. :p


Uh....thanks, I guess? :saywhat:




:laugh:

[Michaelhatesfans]

I disagree. As perhaps the only person on this forum I've actually met (I met a few from 7G), and he didn't choose to attack me or my kids, sexually or otherwise, I give him my slack. :p

It's your pets you have to watch out for.

[Napoleon]

I disagree. As perhaps the only person on this forum I've actually met (I met a few from 7G)

Didn't we meet (I was with Railbird when we did)?

[Andrew Longman]

Didn't we meet (I was with Railbird when we did)?

Sadly, I don't think so. But I don't trust much of what I remember anymore

[Napoleon]

Sadly, I don't think so. But I don't trust much of what I remember anymore

I must be confused without my coffee this morning (or at least enough of it yet). It was someone who was out from NJ way who was with their kid at Cleveland.

[Andrew Longman]

I must be confused without my coffee this morning (or at least enough of it yet). It was someone who was out from NJ way who was with their kid at Cleveland.

Sure sounds like me. Brain damage I'm sure.

SeanO introduced me to a few of us nutjobs at Cleveland. I wore a 7G shirt at least once at Cleveland and it caused a few posters to approach me. I only specifically remember ServiaFan out of Milwaukee though.

I think it was TorontoWorker or Blackflagger (someone from TO) who happened to sit next to me in T9 for a practice at RA in 2001.

There've been others I met at Nazareth but I don't recall who. I guess I'm hear to make an impression on. :gomer: