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ferrarigod
08-04-07, 01:25 AM
The Ferrari team released a statement on Friday angrily refuting allegations that it won the season-opening Australian Grand Prix with an illegal car.

Following McLaren team principal Ron Dennis's open letter to the president of the Italian sporting authority (ACI-CSAI), Luigi Macaluso, on Wednesday – which suggested that the floors used on the Ferraris in Melbourne did not conform with the technical regulations – the Italian team has moved to clraify its position on the matter.

"Ferrari wishes to state very strongly that [Dennis's] letter contains accusations that are both serious and false," read the statement.

"Contrary to the statement put forward by Vodafone McLaren Mercedes, Ferrari never illegally gained any advantage.

"The two F2007 cars used in the Australian Grand Prix were deemed by the Stewards to be in conformity with the technical regulations, before, during and at the end of the event.

"If there had been any illegalities, they would have been disqualified."


According to Dennis's letter, his team received information in March from then-Ferrari employee Nigel Stepney concerning two contentious aspects of the Ferrari F2007: its rear wing separator and a floor attachment mechanism.


As a result McLaren requested a clarification of the rules from the FIA, which subsequently introduced more stringent bodywork deflection tests that forced Ferrari to redesign its floor.

“As far as we are aware, Ferrari ran their cars with this illegal device at the Australian Grand Prix, which they won,” Dennis wrote.

“Ferrari only withdrew the floor device after it was confirmed to be illegal by the FIA."

But Ferrari argues that the FIA did not in fact rule that its car was illegal, but instead simply moved to halt the direction of development on a certain component of the car.

"In fact, what the FIA did next is commonplace," read Ferrari's statement.

"The FIA took the opportunity to issue a clarification on the interpretation of the regulation and then asked the teams concerned to make the necessary modifications.

"There are actually numerous examples of this in both the recent and distant past which have also involved other teams.

"At the next sitting of the FIA International Court of Appeal, Ferrari will fully explain its position on the entire matter."

Ok let me get this straight:
1) McLaren gets illegal information
2)Ferrari Wins in Oz
3) McLaren photocopies documents at a local Kinko's and gets caught
4) McLaren is found to have broken the rules, but is somehow not getting penalized due to the fact that they, 'Did not benefit from Ferrari inside information.'
5) On Wednesday McLaren seeks to steal the race victory at Oz from Ferrari because information they received in stolen documents pointed toward the fact that the car was illegal(although technically it wasn't, cause the rules didn't exist, was just in a gray area not defined, however later clarified by the FIA)

So technically, if I were a thinking human, which Dennis obviously isn't, wouldn't taking victory over Ferrari by complaining from your insider information be construed as an advantage from said stolen information????

Maybe I'm silly, but Ron just admitted to stolen info, and is now using it to try and take the victory.

Sure dumbass, take Ferrari's victory in Oz, but that should then be construed by the FIA as a McLaren advantage by way of stolen information, and then McLaren should be KICKED out of the championship for this year.

This is the most idiotic press release/FIA hearing ever. How you all could call the FIA Fiarrari in the past is beyond me.

Just add this to the Hamilton down 1 lap, grid movements after the restart at the Nurburgring and you have one idiotic situation all against Ferrari.

ferrarigod
08-04-07, 01:27 AM
I just cannot get over this quote

According to Dennis's letter, his team received information in March from then-Ferrari employee Nigel Stepney concerning two contentious aspects of the Ferrari F2007: its rear wing separator and a floor attachment mechanism.

using illegal info to prove something might have been sketchy, further proving your point that you wish to gain advantage from stolen info.

:thumdown: :thumdown: :thumdown:

Someone kick ron dennis' ass. or maybe someone did in middle school and that is part of the problem now.

:shakehead

Gnam
08-04-07, 02:08 AM
Ron Dennis is all about fairness, and he'll lie, cheat, and steal to prove it.


Settle it on track ladies. :)

jonovision_man
08-04-07, 07:53 AM
Is there a link?

Insomniac
08-04-07, 09:37 AM
Don't forget this statement:

"Following our statement of July 3 [admitting the involvement of a McLaren employee in the Stepney case], McLaren has completed a thorough investigation and can confirm that no Ferrari intellectual property has been passed to any other members of the team or incorporated into its cars," the statement said, before inviting the FIA to verify the claim.

NismoZ
08-04-07, 09:46 AM
Crikey. From the look of this morning's qualifying it doesn't seem Ol' Ron has a handle on anyone in either team within his camp. Does one engineer have the authority (temerity?) to hold up the teammate to secure his own driver's position? Sounds like a move that could cost someone a job and I don't think it'll be Hamilton or Dennis!:D

ferrarigod
08-04-07, 01:30 PM
Is there a link?

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=40222

NismoZ
08-04-07, 02:19 PM
Huh, now Flavio is chiming in saying the stolen info from Ferrari on tires and weight distribution alone was enough to save MONTHS of testing and wants McLaren excluded from the '07 title chase and for F-1 to refuse to use McLaren ECUs next season! He figured McLaren was very lucky to go fast right away on B'stones now he thinks thay just plain stole (and USED) the info. The tire switch has been a disaster for Renault. Floors, tires? What's next, rocket fuel again?

Insomniac
08-04-07, 02:26 PM
Huh, now Flavio is chiming in saying the stolen info from Ferrari on tires and weight distribution alone was enough to save MONTHS of testing and wants McLaren excluded from the '07 title chase and for F-1 to refuse to use McLaren ECUs next season! He figured McLaren was very lucky to go fast right away on B'stones now he thinks thay just plain stole (and USED) the info. The tire switch has been a disaster for Renault. Floors, tires? What's next, rocket fuel again?

Interesting. Is that possibly why McLaren can also be gentle on the rear tires like the Ferrari?

NismoZ
08-04-07, 03:09 PM
No doubt 10 years of Bridgestone tire info put the red cars at an advantage going into this season so I guess McLaren figured it was OK to take a shortcut just to even things up?;)

TrueBrit
08-05-07, 11:19 PM
Coupla things:

1) Flavio needs to STFU and concentrate on knocking up over-the-hill supermodels
2) ****ing with Ron Dennis makes about as much sense as stealing a sammich from AJ Foyt...unless you WANT to get your arse kicked
3) Funny how no-one (ferrarigod) seemed to be this up in arms when the FIA stood for Ferrari Innocent Always....

DagoFast
08-06-07, 12:03 AM
TB,

For the yanks and this wop, can you please explain "Go F&%ing swivel"? :D

Methanolandbrats
08-06-07, 07:25 AM
:rofl:

Insomniac
08-06-07, 07:50 AM
Coupla things:

1) Flavio needs to STFU and concentrate on knocking up over-the-hill supermodels
2) ****ing with Ron Dennis makes about as much sense as stealing a sammich from AJ Foyt...unless you WANT to get your arse kicked
3) Funny how no-one (ferrarigod) seemed to be this up in arms when the FIA stood for Ferrari Innocent Always....

If those documents contained a lot of tire testing information, then Flavio is absolutely right.

The WMSC decided McLaren was guilty and then gave them no penalty. It's completely stupid. At least Ferrari was innocent. ;)

ferrarigod
08-07-07, 02:00 AM
If those documents contained a lot of tire testing information, then Flavio is absolutely right.


If you don't think Ferrari instituted some piece on their cars over the years to work with the Bridgestones in an improved way over the other teams, and think they didn't incorporate it in the schematics themselves, that is pretty silly.

Also, it shouldn't be about whether or not the FIA believes they used the copies in the design of their car. It is the fact that they had illegal copies from a current car. Period. If Ferrari spend 100 million and came up with 5 designs that didn't work for McLaren, but McLaren knew they could improve those parts, that is a 100 million dollar head start. Yes, maybe the cars don't look alike, but the mere fact they had them in posession makes all of their improvements subject to the fact that they had already tested and improved upon Ferrari's car development.

Also, it is not ironic at all to me that Renault is struggling when they do have a great chassis. It is about the tires. Williams is improving because they had the rubber early, McLaren however, should be slightly more down the grid. They came on far too quick for me to believe that all of this was just a coincidence.


And TB, what exactly did Ferrari get caught doing illegally from, oh say, 1999-2004? I'll wait. And when you figure out, what was their punishment as well? Surprising how one lambastes Ferrari for years, and yet many say this is no big deal. So get back to me with those Ferrari cheating tidbits.

Toyota has stolen from Ferrari(well known) and now McLaren. When they find McLaren drawings at Stepney's flat, let me know. mm'k?

TrueBrit
08-07-07, 09:32 AM
Fg...the cheating was going on INSIDE the cockpit....;)

Also weren't there various hearings for illegal wings and the like over the years...or do the Ferrari blinders prevent you from remembering such things? As to their punishment? None, just like McLaren.

Next?

Oh, and not to be a pedantic arsehole, but you said "caught cheating"....I don't believe McLaren has been "caught cheating" either, mkay....

Also, ever wonder if those technical documents might PROVE that Ferrari were using an illegal car in OZ and Stepney pinched them as an insurance policy?

Redwing
08-07-07, 11:23 AM
Sure dumbass, take Ferrari's victory in Oz, but that should then be construed by the FIA as a McLaren advantage by way of stolen information, and then McLaren should be KICKED out of the championship for this year.

Agreed.
Isn't that the height of stupidity? If they take Ferrari's victory away, they benefit, based on stolen info!!!

Anyone mention the legality of McLaren's unsupported front wing? Watch Silverstone, that thing flexes in the middle. You can see it clearly on the in-car.

TrueBrit
08-07-07, 01:38 PM
TB,

For the yanks and this wop, can you please explain "Go F&%ing swivel"? :D

You know I finally read the radio conversation transcript in a British paper and I am AMAZED that Hamilton still has a job..points leader or not...:eek:

cameraman
08-07-07, 01:43 PM
Yeah, I don't understand that part of this at all. Hamilton pitches a fit and screws up the refueling order for the team and nothing happens to him. What's up with that? You would think Ron Dennis would have Hamilton's head on a pike at the gate to the McLaren Technology Centre.

Ankf00
08-07-07, 02:50 PM
what a dumbass :shakehead

Insomniac
08-07-07, 04:39 PM
Yeah, I don't understand that part of this at all. Hamilton pitches a fit and screws up the refueling order for the team and nothing happens to him. What's up with that? You would think Ron Dennis would have Hamilton's head on a pike at the gate to the McLaren Technology Centre.

Maybe the team would've been pissed off at only him if Alonso didn't hold him up on the last pit stop. Hamilton clearly isn't the mature, polite driver he has been painted as by the Speed crew, that much is certain.

Methanolandbrats
08-07-07, 04:52 PM
Maybe the team would've been pissed off at only him if Alonso didn't hold him up on the last pit stop. Hamilton clearly isn't the mature, polite driver he has been painted as by the Speed crew, that much is certain. He is a ruthless, round headed, cheating British Bastard.

cameraman
08-07-07, 05:15 PM
He is a ruthless, round headed, cheating British Bastard.

Which means he should fit in well in Formula 1.

TrueBrit
08-07-07, 05:27 PM
He is a ruthless, round headed, cheating British Bastard.

"cheating"....not yet anyway...;)

ferrarigod
08-07-07, 07:00 PM
You know I finally read the radio conversation transcript in a British paper and I am AMAZED that Hamilton still has a job..points leader or not...:eek:

link peas.

Insomniac
08-07-07, 07:09 PM
"cheating"....not yet anyway...;)

He does chop though!

ferrarigod
08-07-07, 07:37 PM
He does chop though!

as any good driver would. ;)

cameraman
08-07-07, 08:00 PM
I found this quote from Hamilton


I was the first in line for the green light. When I got to the end of the pit lane, the team told me, 'Lewis, let Fernando pass.' But Kimi was very close, too. I didn't want to mess up my opportunity by changing places or whatever there was to do, and be open to being overtaken by Kimi and losing my place. That's why we had the disagreement, because I didn't agree with it and I didn't do what they wanted me to do.

jonovision_man
08-07-07, 08:02 PM
Bad call by Hammy. :thumdown:

Team tells you to do something you do it. Instead Alonso looks like a whanker (is there an "h" in whanker?) and you're still mumbling about how long his pit stop took. :p

jono

Insomniac
08-07-07, 10:25 PM
I found this quote from Hamilton

More:

SR: You were meant to be behind Fernando in the fuel-burn phase of the session, that didn't happen, exactly why?

LH: I always like to be out first. The crew on my side did a better job of getting my car out first, mainly because I finished my Q2 lap earlier than Fernando. So I was able to get out of the pitlane first. And at the end of the pitlane they said let Fernando past.

This is something that the team had agreed, but they didn't give me an explanation exactly why.

I've done it in the past, I let him past in Monaco and Barcelona and I just thought I'll do it.

But at the point when we were at the end of the pitlane there was me, Fernando and Kimi. So I was thinking I can't let him past at the first corner because then I will lose my position to Kimi.

So I realised I had to make a split decision and I decided to go for it. If I'm quick enough, he'll keep up with me and we'll both gain an extra lap.

He backed off. I was told and told again to let Fernando past, but he was off in the distance and I just got on with my job.

I am in a lot of trouble with my boss.
http://www.itv-f1.com/Feature.aspx?Type=General&PO_ID=40289

cameraman
08-08-07, 12:41 PM
I am in a lot of trouble with my boss.

Gee, you think?:shakehead