View Full Version : LMP2s Get 5% Less Air
ALMS will now go along with the ACO rules and create a little more separation between the classes. I still think they should go the other way and just create a larger P1 class. Maybe a class for turbo bio-Diesel hybrids?:)
jonovision_man
06-20-07, 08:49 PM
Yeah, it'd probably still be exciting catching 5% less air... ;)
http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/thumb/f/f3/180px-CLR_Flip.jpg
(Before someone points it out, yes, I know that's not an LMP2... it's a joke. :))
jono
ferrarigod
06-20-07, 09:30 PM
Yeah, it'd probably still be exciting catching 5% less air... ;)
http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/thumb/f/f3/180px-CLR_Flip.jpg
(Before someone points it out, yes, I know that's not an LMP2... it's a joke. :))
jono
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^That's not a LMP1
This is:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=wM4guvo6Ifo
Methanolandbrats
06-20-07, 09:39 PM
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^That's not a LMP1
This is:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=wM4guvo6Ifo
6/10........nice takeoff, excellent rotation, but four point deduction for not sticking the landing.
jonovision_man
06-20-07, 09:49 PM
http://youtube.com/watch?v=rQbgSe9S54I
jono
ferrarigod
06-20-07, 10:58 PM
http://youtube.com/watch?v=rQbgSe9S54I
jono
full speed, wild. 3rd flight during that '99 CLR Le Mans attempt if i am remembering correctly. twice with Mark Webber. Either way, lots of air, to get back on topic.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Ow3rxq7U1mA&mode=related&search=
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^That's not a LMP1
This is:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=wM4guvo6Ifo
If you think that is an LMP1, you need to clean your glasses....
opinionated ow
06-21-07, 05:26 AM
about bloody time!
FCYTravis
06-21-07, 06:46 AM
Ah yes, can't have those nasty lowly P2 cars spoiling our Audi parade up front, can we?
:shakehead
****'s sake, the only drama in Audi class - I mean P1 - was watching to find out if P2s would beat them. It for sure wasn't finding out how many laps Autocon would lose to the Audis.
chop456
06-21-07, 07:06 AM
Ah yes, can't have those nasty lowly P2 cars spoiling our Audi parade up front, can we?
Get back to us when the faster P2 cars are made to grid behind the P1's. :laugh:
At least IMSA has an excuse.
FCYTravis
06-21-07, 10:22 AM
Get back to us when the faster P2 cars are made to grid behind the P1's. :laugh:
Um, yeah, that was almost five years ago.
BTW, what's IMSA's excuse? They've got to listen to a bunch of French people tell them how to run their series? Some excuse. :shakehead
Seriously, things were starting to get interesting in ALMS because the P2s could run with the P1s. Great battles, close racing... but no, we can't have that? Why on Earth would they go and screw up a good thing?
Sean O'Gorman
06-21-07, 10:45 AM
I'm sure Penske and Dyson love this ruling, even though they don't even run at Le Mans.
Funny, I thought it was called American Le Mans Series. Ensuring that lower classes go slower isn't anything new to any series. The real problem is the lack of P1 participants.
Funny, I thought it was called American Le Mans Series. Ensuring that lower classes go slower isn't anything new to any series. The real problem is the lack of P1 participants.So, let the little guys run with the big dogs. Only thing that makes the P1 battle worth while. Sort of tongue-in-cheek.
Sort of.
So, let the little guys run with the big dogs. Only thing that makes the P1 battle worth while. Sort of tongue-in-cheek.
Sort of.
I'm not a hard-core sportscar racing fan, so I don't know the politics of the situation, but it seems right to keep the classes separated to keep a clean distinction. Besides, maybe Penske/Porsche and Acura are thinking about a move up to P1 anyway? I'm sure they are considering it, but the diesel advantage may keep them away as well. Maybe they will wait until the new closed-cockpit prototypes start in a couple years.
ferrarigod
06-21-07, 01:18 PM
If you think that is an LMP1, you need to clean your glasses....
(Before someone points it out, yes, I know that's not an LMP2... it's a joke. :))
jono
a little slow on the uptake.
FCYTravis
06-21-07, 01:26 PM
Porsche is not interested in building prototypes that customers won't buy. They're in racing to make money, not spend it. Right now, customers won't buy anything in P1 because... yeah, it's pretty much a waste of money to even try and get on the same lap with Audi. So P2 is the only viable option.
Maybe they'll wait for the new closed-cockpit prototypes in a couple of years... but isn't that what we've heard about ALMS for the last decade? "Wait till next year?" When is next year, the year?
The lack of P1 participants is a problem that will not be solved by slowing down the P2 cars. All that you're going to do there, is piss off the people who invested in P2 cars.
cameraman
06-21-07, 01:33 PM
Maybe the people who have invested in P2 cars should worry about building a car that can enter and finish Le Mans before they worry about being faster than a P1 in a sprint race in Utah.
chop456
06-21-07, 02:00 PM
Porsche is not interested in building prototypes that customers won't buy. They're in racing to make money, not spend it. So the people saying Porsche will move up are wrong and you're right. 10-4. ;)
Right now, customers won't buy anything in P1 because... yeah, it's pretty much a waste of money to even try and get on the same lap with Audi.
2 new Creations in P1 and one resold Lola. You're wrong x3.
So P2 is the only viable option.
Because beating 4 Porsches+3 Acuras is easier than beating 2 Audis. :gomer:
Maybe they'll wait for the new closed-cockpit prototypes in a couple of years... but isn't that what we've heard about ALMS for the last decade? "Wait till next year?" When is next year, the year?The year for what? Big fields of tube-framed junk and eggciting side-by-side rubbin' and racin'? The yokels can keep it. Grand Am is what it is. Every Thanksgiving dinner needs a kids table, and they're it.
The lack of P1 participants is a problem that will not be solved by slowing down the P2 cars. All that you're going to do there, is piss off the people who invested in P2 cars.
Acura has said they want to move up to P1. Porsche is rumored. How much do you suppose those "customer" teams "invested" in their P2 equipment. :rofl:
Batting .000 so far, but keep swinging.
Batting .000 so far, but keep swinging.
:laugh: :rofl: :laugh:
Sean O'Gorman
06-21-07, 02:27 PM
So because you didn't like what he said, its automatically wrong?
Methanolandbrats
06-21-07, 02:28 PM
The year for what? Big fields of tube-framed junk and eggciting side-by-side rubbin' and racin'? The yokels can keep it. Grand Am is what it is. Every Thanksgiving dinner needs a kids table, and they're it.
.:laugh: :laugh:
... but isn't that what we've heard about ALMS for the last decade? "Wait till next year?" When is next year, the year?
ALMS has been interesting racing to me every year for the last decade. Endurance sportscar racing doesn't need to have on-track battles to keep my interest. The subtle strategies, high tech cars, and manufacturer differentiation are what keep it interesting for me.
jonovision_man
06-21-07, 02:40 PM
Ah yes, can't have those nasty lowly P2 cars spoiling our Audi parade up front, can we?
:shakehead
****'s sake, the only drama in Audi class - I mean P1 - was watching to find out if P2s would beat them. It for sure wasn't finding out how many laps Autocon would lose to the Audis.
I tend to agree, it was interesting to see the LMP2s getting up there. No reason they shouldn't be going toe-to-toe, even as their own distinct class. Nobody complained when the Corvettes won the overall in that one race a few years ago. ;)
jono
Don Quixote
06-21-07, 02:59 PM
Batting .000 so far, but keep swinging.
Chop comes out strong with a Silva-type response! :laugh:
An autosport article from March: article (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/56999)
Seems to indicate Porsche won't move up. It is three months old though.
At the end of the Utah race, McNish was complaining that the Audi's never had a chance after the yellow. Is this the issue he was complaining about?
ferrarigod
06-21-07, 05:02 PM
ALMS has been interesting racing to me every year for the last decade. Endurance sportscar racing doesn't need to have on-track battles to keep my interest. The subtle strategies, high tech cars, and manufacturer differentiation are what keep it interesting for me.
Exactly. You can't have NASCAR 'side by side' racing for 24hrs, so what is the point in even trying? GAARA can try all they wish, but I'd rather watch cars that peak my interest be 2 laps ahead at the end of 24hrs than watch 2 greenhouse fabcars be 1 lap apart.
Also, the only reason Audi ran away from everyone is because no one was competing against them. Cadillac doesn't count as a serious attempt.
cameraman
06-21-07, 05:44 PM
At the end of the Utah race, McNish was complaining that the Audi's never had a chance after the yellow. Is this the issue he was complaining about? Not really. The P2s pitted during the early yellow because they had fubar'd the start. That pit strategy won them the race.
FCYTravis
06-21-07, 09:20 PM
2 new Creations in P1 and one resold Lola. You're wrong x3.
I'll pay you $100 cash if any non-Audi P1 wins the class this year. I'll pay you $25 if any non-Audi P1 even finishes on the same lap with the winning Audi this year.
That's one bet I'm quite sure I won't have to pay out on.
The ALMS had a great story - P2 cars going up against P1 cars for the overall win. Straight fight. Great battles. They just threw it away... for what? So Audi can win every race for the rest of the season, again?
skidmarks
06-22-07, 12:28 AM
A great story? That is just stupid, a P2 unrestricted beating a restricted P1.
It isn't a welterweight moving up to fight a middleweight, this is one arm tied behind your back fighting. :shakehead
FCYTravis
06-22-07, 06:43 AM
What's "restricted" about a P1?
skidmarks
06-22-07, 12:15 PM
Sorry, perhaps I should have said Audi, or Diesel, restrictions.
extramundane
06-22-07, 12:20 PM
Sorry, perhaps I should have said Audi, or Diesel, restrictions.
What restrictions would those be? The laughably smaller fuel tank? Because that's the only thing remotely resembling a "restriction" on the Audi or any diesel.
Andrew Longman
06-22-07, 12:28 PM
The P1 vs P2 was getting to be a good story, but it was an indication of a bigger problem. Not enough competitor in P1 and companies such as Acura and Porsche choosing to enter the series at P2 instead of P1.
Its OK I suppose if P2 made sense for them in terms of selling customer cars/engines, but not when P1 has too little manufacturer involvement overall.
Either way, I don't see how taking 5% air away does anything to solve the underlying problem.
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