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SAdair
04-23-07, 01:53 PM
Interesting article from the Cleveland PD. Every couple of years someone pushes the idea of turning Burke airport into condos, parks, etc. This article lists the reasons why that may or may not happen.

What to do with Burke?
Its past as landfill complicates future
Monday, April 23, 2007
Joan Mazzolini, Plain Dealer Reporter

The vast expanse of land that makes up Burke Lakefront Airport has tantalized residents for decades as the last, best hope to give Cleveland a real lakefront, akin to Chicago, Milwaukee or Toronto.

And with two underperforming local airports -- Burke and Cuyahoga County -- the refrain from various quarters has long been to close Burke and merge operations.

But the hurdles to use Burke's 450 acres for a commercial center or housing or even a massive park are greater and more expensive than many realize.

While often called prime lakefront land, the reality is very different.

Most of Burke sits on garbage and dredge material. In fact, a Cleveland city dump since the time of horse-drawn wagons was located there and the garbage was burned until the 1950s.

Workers doing any digging on or near Burke are required to wear environmental hazmat suits because of the contamination, which includes PCBs, methane, oil, car tires and other debris.

Mike Hoyle, chief executive of Business Aircraft Group Inc., an aircraft management and sales company at Burke, doesn't believe the airport can be closed, both for the economic benefit it brings to Cleveland and for the simple reason that turning the land into a park would be too expensive.

City officials and others estimate that Burke contributes at least $100 million a year to the economy.

"You dig 4 feet and you're in sludge," Hoyle said. "My building sits on 6-foot-wide footers and it has settled 9 inches. You can't build a high-rise here."

Hoyle said that pilings had to be driven deep to support the one-story Aviation High School.

"There are limitations with the soil situation," said David Beach, executive director of EcoCity Cleveland. EcoCity Cleveland was part of a group that sponsored a report on Burke and its future in 2002.

"You can't build on the entire site because of the stability and hazardous chemicals," said Beach, who believes it could be reused in the future. "It will take careful study of what is feasible and desirable."

But long before any new use of the land can even be considered, another question must be answered.

Can it be done? Can Burke, in fact, be closed?

That may be finally answered, with a master plan of the airport that Burke Commissioner Khalid Bahhur expects to be complete later this year.

It would finally answer the question of "does Burke stay or does it go?"

"If it stays, we'll be able to say here's why, and if it goes, here's why," Bahhur said.

Businesses associated with Burke look forward to a definitive answer.

Under Mayor Michael White, they knew Burke was safe, they said. But for most of the last 30 years, there has been a "what if" about Burke that has created a difficult situation.

"It's very difficult to run a business out of Burke. No one will invest money here . . . until you get the confidence it isn't going to close," Hoyle said. "It's always been on the bubble."

If Burke goes, and the process could take years, a big question is where do the hospital helicopters, the Federal Reserve flights, the flight schools, corporate jets and others that use Burke go?

Some say other close-by reliever airports, such as Cuyahoga County, Lost Nation and Lorain County, could take portions. Of those, only Cuyahoga County has a control tower.

Using Hopkins is problematic because of the large commercial air traffic.

But Cuyahoga County Airport has its own problems, with the runways in need of immediate repair and renovation if the airport wants to keep its biggest client, Flight Options.

In fact, the spokesman said the runway conditions and snow removal work have caused Flight Options, which allows people to own fractional shares in a plane, to move some plane maintenance work to other cities.

"They [runways and taxiways] are above the FAA minimum standards," said Dennis Baker, director of corporate communications for Flight Options. And Baker said it wants to work with the county. But he added, the "clock is ticking" on how long Flight Options can wait for improvements before looking to move its headquarters and hundreds of employees elsewhere.

To close Burke, Cleveland would probably have to repay the Federal Aviation Administration $4.1 million in grants it received for airport upkeep.

But it might not be that simple.

The FAA could require Cleveland not just to move all operations to other airports, but could also require the city to reproduce Burke and its acreage at a different location.

"It's more than simply repaying the money," said FAA spokesman Tony Molinaro. "We would do an airspace study . . . to see what the consequences are and does this create more congestion.

"We can say 'No, you can't close this.' "

Longtime Burke Commissioner Mike Barth, who left to run Lorain County airport, said he believes you can give people more access and keep the airport.

Barth, who left in 1999 after 28 years at Burke, including 10 as the airport's commissioner, said dredged material should continue to be dumped at Burke, which would ultimately allow a runway to be added to the north.

In the meantime, the southwest portion, near the old Hornblowers restaurant, could be opened up for the public.

Others, like Cuyahoga County Commissioner Jimmy Dimora, say gaining access to the land and the lakefront is too important; that even with all the hurdles, it would be better if Burke were closed.

"We all know the lakefront would be really prime land. We could have parks, entertainment, housing and retail," Dimora said.

"What land in the county isn't contaminated? You'll have to build with pilings," he said. "It's more difficult, more costly. But it's more desirable."

To reach this Plain Dealer reporter:

jmazzolini@plaind.com, 216-999-4563

© 2007 The Plain Dealer
© 2007 cleveland.com All Rights Reserved.

SAdair
04-23-07, 01:54 PM
Here is another article that advocates keeping Burke open and closing the smaller county airport

Close underused county airport, move operations to Burke, some say
Monday, April 23, 2007
Joan Mazzolini, Plain Dealer Reporter

Advocates for improving access to Cleveland's lake shore have long suggested Burke Lakefront Airport could be closed and overflow traffic could move to other, smaller airports in the region.

But some airport experts suggest that it would make more sense to keep Burke and close Cuyahoga County Airport instead.

If the county airport were to replace Burke, it would probably need to add a runway, which would be difficult with neighborhoods that have grown around it in Willoughby Hills, Richmond Heights and Highland Heights.

If that were required, the outcry of neighbors would probably be even louder than what came out of Willoughby Hills recently when they learned one possibility of runway expansion was into that community.

It would be much easier, said former Burke Commissioner Mike Barth and others, to close Cuyahoga County Airport and let homes go up there, and move its operations to Burke, which already has the longer, wider runways.

Both airports could handle much more business.

Last year, Burke had fewer than 78,000 operations - a takeoff or a landing - down from its high of 100,000 in 2000, according to Federal Aviation Administration statistics. Twenty-eight percent of those last year included student pilots practicing touchdowns and takeoffs.

An increase in planes of fewer than 50 seats, thought of as air taxis, kept Burke from having a decrease in total operations for a third year in a row.

Burke has the capacity for 222,000 operations a year, according to a long-out-of-date plan. But its long runways allow it to handle large planes, such as a 757 that recently landed with a sports team or the huge military planes that arrive each year for the annual air show.

Cuyahoga County Airport was also down from a high in 1999 of almost 75,000 annual operations. Last year there were barely 52,000 operations. About 30 percent of those were flight training.

The county airport also saw an increase in its air taxi flights. Even without expanding the runway needed for safety and to handle the newer small-but-powerful jets, the county airport could handle 120,000 operations.

What's missing at both places is business plans, say people like Barth and Tom Slavin, owner of Million Air, a Burke aircraft fuel business.

In fact, some say the best approach would be to have Burke, Cuyahoga County Airport, Lorain County Regional Airport and Lost Nation Airport in Lake County all working together under a single business plan. That would allow revenue sharing and decisions about expansion or new opportunities to be based on what makes the most sense for each airport and its surrounding community.

"Running airports is running a business; they need marketing staff . . . they need professional oversight and not political," Slavin said of Burke and Cuyahoga County airports.

"How do they get new business?" he said. "Do they think it will fall out of the sky?"

Burke Commissioner Khalid Bahhur said the city is working on a marketing plan for Burke that should be completed this year. The county is also committed to improving airport operations, including runway improvements and expansion.

To reach this Plain Dealer reporter:

jmazzolini@plaind.com, 216-999-4563
© 2007 The Plain Dealer
© 2007 cleveland.com All Rights Reserved.

nrc
04-23-07, 02:00 PM
"What land in the county isn't contaminated?":laugh:

We really prefer that you post a portion of the article and a link to the rest.

Sean O'Gorman
04-23-07, 05:46 PM
Tom Slavin, owner of Million Air, a Burke aircraft fuel business.

Hey, I used to work for that guy.

Spicoli
04-23-07, 08:23 PM
Hey, I used to work for that guy.


Yeah, we know. :laugh:


http://i18.tinypic.com/4beljjt.jpg

opinionated ow
04-23-07, 08:49 PM
typical nimbys. same problem in this part of the world. drives me mad, if they were to get there way we would have nowhere to take-off or land. it is bad enough that their whinging requires special procedures...bet you lanigan and co are pissed off about htis too....

Ray Scar
04-24-07, 11:12 AM
It's very difficult to close an airport that has received FAA grant money. After the Meigs debacle in Chicago it's even harder, especially for anything designated as a reliever. Repaying the money does not wipe out the obligation to keep it open.

Easy
04-24-07, 11:41 AM
It's very difficult to close an airport that has received FAA grant money. After the Meigs debacle in Chicago it's even harder, especially for anything designated as a reliever. Repaying the money does not wipe out the obligation to keep it open.

That wasn't a debacle. That was Lord Daley showing the governor and all the Fortune 500 big wigs that used Meigs as a heliport who is in charge. And they said his dad was the last of the big city bosses.

pchall
04-25-07, 03:28 PM
Closing a bizjet field is always a bad idea. People down here would like to close Lunken Field and develop it as park land. Procter & God would really be screwed since they fly G5s out of there every day.

RARules
04-26-07, 08:51 PM
That wasn't a debacle. That was Lord Daley showing the governor and all the Fortune 500 big wigs that used Meigs as a heliport who is in charge. And they said his dad was the last of the big city bosses.

Daley wanted to turn it into a park. The only real reason for the continued existence of Meigs Field was that the state politicians from Springfield wanted an airport to land on that was most convenient todowntown Chicago.

I had moved out of the area by that time, but as I recall, the City of Chicago owned Meigs field (controlling its fate withlittle anyone else could say about it), and the only reason that Daley didn't close it earlier was because of pressure from the former Rebublican governor - the (now imprisoned???) George Ryan. After Blegoyavich (sp?) - a Democrat - was elected as Governor, that removed much of the pressure. So he brought bulldozers (with police cruiser protection) in the middle of the night to make his point by dozing parts of the runway.

Yes, power politics. Makes for interesting news programs.

dando
04-26-07, 10:20 PM
Daley wanted to turn it into a park. The only real reason for the continued existence of Meigs Field was that the state politicians from Springfield wanted an airport to land on that was most convenient todowntown Chicago.

I had moved out of the area by that time, but as I recall, the City of Chicago owned Meigs field (controlling its fate withlittle anyone else could say about it), and the only reason that Daley didn't close it earlier was because of pressure from the former Rebublican governor - the (now imprisoned???) George Ryan. After Blegoyavich (sp?) - a Democrat - was elected as Governor, that removed much of the pressure. So he brought bulldozers (with police cruiser protection) in the middle of the night to make his point by dozing parts of the runway.

Yes, power politics. Makes for interesting news programs.

Daley is a moron and a relic from the past:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meigs_Field#Closing_of_Meigs_Field

-Kevin

grungex
04-28-07, 01:07 AM
Daley is a moron and a relic from the past

Yet he still keeps getting re-elected...

chop456
04-28-07, 08:59 AM
Daley is an embarrassment to the city, a scumbag and a twit who can't speak a complete sentence without note cards.

G.
04-28-07, 10:02 AM
Daley is an embarrassment to the city, a scumbag and a twit who can't speak a complete sentence without note cards.

he's a lot like FTG, only he actually DOES have power. Inherited, of course.

Easy
04-28-07, 10:36 PM
Daley getting re-elected isn't 100% related to democracy in action. "The City That Works" is a title that actually has less to do with jobs and more a description of machine politics.

Meigs was never big enough for a race anyway. Grant Park is though. But it will never happen.

nrc
04-28-07, 10:49 PM
Let's keep Chicago politics out of this. Obviously if there are Cleveland politics relevant to the Cleveland event that's fine.

Easy
04-28-07, 10:53 PM
Let's keep Chicago politics out of this. Obviously if there are Cleveland politics relevant to the Cleveland event that's fine.


Half the thread is about Dick Daley.

datachicane
04-30-07, 11:22 AM
http://www.nndb.com/people/977/000023908/dick-dale.jpg